(September 17, 2015 at 1:00 pm)Lek Wrote:(September 17, 2015 at 4:26 am)BrianSoddingBoru4 Wrote: I think you've fallen into special pleading, here. You say that if you saw Jesus, you would believe him. You also say that you believe the testimony of people who make claims about Jesus. Those aren't two equivalent cases. If I were to see a water buffalo in my kitchen, standing and thoughtfully chewing, making water buffalo noises and emitting water buffalo smells, I would be justified in believing that I have a water buffalo in my kitchen. If I make the claim to you that I have a water buffalo in my kitchen, it would be reasonable for you to doubt me, as a kitchen in a small town in New Zealand is an unlikely habitat for a water buffalo.
I've never seen anyone - anyone at all - walk on water, wither a fig tree with a word, heal lepers with a touch, turn water into wine, bring a dead person back to life, calm a storm, or feed thousands with a handful of bread and fish. All of these are such extraordinarily unlikely events that it's perfectly fair of me to not accept the testimony of alleged witnesses whom I cannot interview (because they're all, like, dead and stuff).
Jesus is your water-buffalo-in-the-kitchen. You believe the stories to be true because you want the stories to be true. This is the very essence of '...wishful thinking or whatever'. God is your unnecessary assumption.
Boru
So you're from New Zealand. For some reason, I always thought you were from England. I guess I can't distinguish a New Zealand accent from a British one. Sorry. Not only do I believe the testimony, but I've been into a deeper study of the old testament, and I'm amazed at how things link up with the new testament story. It's eye-opening to read the prophesies that were fulfilled at a later time and documented by different writers.
Yeah, I'm always blown away when narratives are made to "fit" the prophetic tradition in which the authors were versed. It's . . . miraculous!
And I'd like to see a response to Min's point that the Jews don't agree with the Christians' take on the alleged fulfillment of the prophecies.