Seeing red

[bennyboy]

......and you think that materialists have a definition or description for ideas or mind that cannot distinguish between those things and a rock?  I doubt that you're going to have any light shone on something if you don't shine some yourself.  

You seem to be enraged by a position I'm not taking.

It is, and if it were the same expression -or- organization of the same stuff there'd be no need to call dna "dna" and ideas "ideas".  We could call them both fleeflarps.  You;ve already expressed every criticism I could make of these comments -yourself-.  A boat and an airplane aren't the same thing, even though they're both made of metal.  Certain expressions, certain reasons.  This was a pointless non-objection in defense of a pointless non-definition..........

Okay, so let's get a precise definition that doesn't beg the question. If you're going to say, "Ideas are whatever the brain does" in the end, then I'll agree but there will be nothing more to talk about.

Whats makes you think that we can talk physics -rather- than qualia?  All things of which we are aware seem to interact between things and events.

That's right, and I considered adding a sentence in anticipation of this argument. However, the vocabulary we use in talking about qualia and physics is different. When I talk about my experience of a painting, I'll say something like, "That particular orange has such a warm feeling to it." When I talk about the brain function behind that experience, I'll talk about blood flow, brain waves, or maybe the release of NTs from specific neurons. I'm saying let's forget the qualitative language and go straight for the quantitative: if there is an idea, in any physical system in the universe, how is it to be recognized (or even manipulated)?

 If this made dna and ideas the same thing it makes -everything- the same and we can throw in the towel with all this naming business.  I see no will in dna.  Show us this will?   A memory state, sure, I can run with that...but you know I'm a comp mind guy,and you need more than memory to make a comp system.  Do you expect a memory cell to have ideas?  I don't.  My cup of coffee is an effective memory cell (and it's made of the same stuff too, way way down, as dna, bonus!).  In all the time I've known it it hasn't given me the slightest reason to think it either possesses a single idea or is an idea....and buddy, me and that cup are close, we share alot of time together and I'm certain I'd have noticed by now.

What's will? It's a tendency to act. The will of the DNA to reproduce is so strong that the instincts represented in it wall subvert a person's conscious decision-making. I don't want to have a baby, but mannnn that girl in the bar is so hot. Maybe I'll just play around in the backseat of my Imapala. Well. . . she's naked now. . . it wouldn't hurt to stick it in for just a second, right? Wait. . . she won't get off me. . . girl stop moving like that. . . I . . . I. . .

Reproduction achieved. Will of DNA: 1; will of independent young man: 0