13 Questions

[Statler Waldorf]

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I see your point G-sprite, but I somewhat disagree. The Reformed position is that all that are truly saved persevere to the end. So it logically follows that those who fall away were never truly saved.

Do you have any examples you can give where Christians lied about being atheists prior to their conversion?

There is a difference between the person being sincere and 'being saved'. What I tried to say is that when someone (de)converts others might say 'well I guess he was always just faking a bit anyways'. I person can sincerely be a Christian, but still change their minds later. A person can also sincerely be an atheist and change their minds later on. See my point?

As for examples of 'atheists becoming believers', I can't give a 'famous person' example out of the top of my head. But I have seen Christians on forums like these before proclaiming they had been atheist until they saw the light. Upon further questioning they'd reveal that they had spent a period of their life hating god and blaming him. That is not atheism - if you're hating god and blaming him (as opposed of disliking religion itself) you are still believing in him. That is the point where they misunderstood atheism.

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Oh ok, I follow you now.

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Statler

It is obvious to me that no-one by themselves stranded on a desert island could come up with the judeo christian concept of god by themselves.
They may come up with other things to worship but jahweh no way.
To believe in this rubbish takes in doctrination. that is my point.

But you know what, people will just believe any old shit, read this article about a man who died accidentally in russia after burying himself alive 'for luck'.

http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/world-europe-13623938

So you just believe what the hell you like, just remember to me you are no different from this russian idiot.

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If people could not come up with the concept of Yahweh on their own, then where did the concept come from in your opinion? Christians don't believe that all of the attributes of the God of the Bible would just naturally be known to someone on an island. However, His existence, power, and glory are attested to by His creation (Romans 1), so that much should be naturally known. Does that make any sense?