For Tackattack

[tackattack]

OK bozo and Sae, please try and keep it on topic. I appreciate the occasional distraction, but it's to the point of a distraction now.

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2-Your reasons for your bigotry are irrelevant as

Bigotry
1. Obstinately convinced of the superiority or correctness of one's own opinions and prejudiced against those who hold different opinions.
2. Expressing or characterized by prejudice and intolerance.

I may not have been clear, sorry. I have perfectly good reasons for hating ‘religion’. True I didn’t give you them, you may actually argue with them. But in my book bigotry means not having valid reasons for one’s view. Hating something doesn’t make me a bigot, if my reasons are valid.

I am not ‘obstinately convinced’. I have perfectly sound reasons for my hatred. They are much the same as laid out by Dawkins and Hitchens. If you want to argue them that’s fine.
If you can convince me that god exists or that religion is benign, then I will readily change my mind.

My morals are far superior to your religion’s morals. Debate it if you wish. I am not intolerant of gays. I don’t demand kowtowing and knee-bending to my presence. I don’t demand worship. I don’t demand than you eschew other gods. I don’t pretend to eat someone’s flesh and drink their blood.

You however have no verifiable evidence for your belief other than your ‘feelings’. Nothing I say to you will convince you that you are wrong. Not now, not ever.

By your own definition then you are a bigot.


I apologised for a false accusation, can you?

2-Your reasons for your bigotry are irrelevant as

So anything I hate, whether justified or not, is bigotry. Reasons are irrelevant?

So is it bigotry to hate stoning of adulterers? I have perfectly good reasons for hating muslim execution practices, but they are irrelevant? What piffle.
I assume you wrote this nonsense with reflex anger. I would be very interested to know if this was the case or not.

3- Your opinion of me matters even less than care about your "evidence" and I'll answer your question only because it was directed to me, not to pander to your ego. I do not believe religion or morality should be taught in public schools. It should be reserved for Churches and homes. Private schools can do what the parents pay them for.

That’s not what I asked. Let me re-phrase it for you. Do you believe that Christian dogma/doctrine should be taught to children under the age of 18.
The point being that they will be unable to make a valid assessment during their formative years for such dogma. Much of which is based on fear and repression.

Churches should teach morality, are you serious?
If you analyse the bible and list the things that god does most frequently then:-
top of the list - He kills people
Second on the list - He tells people to kill other people.
Appearing to the faithful and conjuring universes come way down the list.
This is your basis for morality? And you call me a bigot?
Sheesh kebab

edit added 'most frequently' for sense

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To tackattack

I have been appallingly nasty to you and I apologise.
I have let my disgust of religion become personal.


If you wish to discuss religious matters, I am happy to do so, as long as you understand my position.
If you wish it I will leave you alone.


:flowers:

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"anything I hate, whether justified or not, is bigotry. Reasons are irrelevant?" yes and yes. I'm bigoted about anyone who would rape a child. I've expressed it and I don't think anyone can change it. That makes me a bigot. How rational or justified it is doesn't matter. I obstinately hold to a prejudice or intolerance. Mine, in this case, is based off of someone's actions, not their beliefs. I also feel it is a socially acceptable justified position. Hating a group of people for their beliefs, however certain members of that group have affected you or whatever your reasons, I feel is not only bigotry, but irrational bigotry. If you're going to hate a group of people, why not make is a group of people you've actually interacted with? I'm not aware of any group of people I claim to hate, based on their beliefs or ideals. Do I admit I'm a bigot? yes. Is it more rational that yours.. in this case I believe yes.
You haven't been nasty to me, but I'll accept your flowered apology. Mainly because this probably isn't the first time you've let your disgust of religion bias you blindly. Now stop all of this personal banter and onto the points. I'll restate the ones you ignored and renumber for clarity.

1- You falsely assume my religious morality. I'll list some of my relevant morality (that stem from my religion not from my subjective morality): I am not intolerant of gays. I'm not forced to kowtow or knee-bend to my God, the motto of our church is "come as you are". My God doesn’t demand worship. I offer it freely for what he does for me. There are no other God's I'm aware of, or have experienced, at this time. I don’t pretend to eat someone’s flesh and drink their blood.

2- I have plenty of subjective experience, rational understanding and logical conclusions for my belief. You could however convince me it is irrational or illogical, I'm completely open to being wrong. I've been wrong many times before.

3- I responded to your omnimax on page 2 which you said nothing about here .

4-Omnimax is in the urban dictionary and there is a wiki entry for it. It's quite common and not nearly as "made up" as you want to make it out to be. As far as tautology, I only use the term omnipotent in a circle of believers or theologians. None of them believe that one word or concept could ever encompass God and realize it's a loosely defined shorthand for what we understand of God's power.
You have not made a case that any Christian, much less anyone you can find here, believes that God has the power to anything even the logically impossible.

5-"Do you believe that Christian dogma/doctrine should be taught to children under the age of 18?" Yes, I believe morality, accountability, problem solving, rationality, logic and decision making skill should be taught and developed all of their lives but specifically from the age of reason on directly. They can make valid assessments if given more than a one sided approach. I teach
Sunday school for instance. I teach from our Church's viewpoint, my viewpoint , other religious viewpoints and encourage questions and critical thinking. I try not to base anything I do on fear and repression.

6- The attributes of God isn't what makes me Christian, nor any other Christian a Christian. Being a Christian comes down to something really simple: Reliance on the character, teaching and sacrifice of Christ Jesus. We can argue all our lives on whether God is Good, ambivalent, hateful, greedy or whatever, and it wouldn't make one iota of difference to most Christians, because by definition it is unknowable. Stick to what you can argue and work on that.