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Potter to the clay
#52
RE: Potter to the clay
(September 5, 2011 at 7:50 am)ElDinero Wrote: Human beings are not property.

He wanted to explore the question supposing this God exists. Since your answer supposes this God does not exist, it is outside the context of the question. (That is to say, given the existence of this God, which his question posits, human beings are indeed property—not of other human beings but of God.)

(September 5, 2011 at 7:50 am)ElDinero Wrote: I don't acknowledge anybody's right over my life.

Refusing to acknowledge X has no bearing on whether or not you are X. The latter is the question, not the former. And, again, it is a question that supposes the existence of the God in Francis Chan's reference to the Potter.




(September 5, 2011 at 7:57 am)frankiej Wrote: I would say he doesn't have the right to treat us in whatever way he likes.

It is not enough to claim that God does not have the right if the claim is without an explanation of why not. Given the existence of this God, as the question posits, WHY does he not have this right? The parent analogy fails because parents do not have the Potter relationship to their children that this God has to us.




(September 5, 2011 at 8:30 am)Rhythm Wrote: Ryft asking people to leave books aside... lol?

I am only accommodating the OP, who does not have the book with him to cite the relevant pages. Since this makes it difficult to interact with Francis Chan's argument, which the OP indicated, we have to set it aside and instead deal with the question as the OP posited it.

(September 5, 2011 at 8:30 am)Rhythm Wrote: We have this idea that human beings aren't to be treated as property—

—by fellow human beings, and for a myriad of good reasons. But extending this idea to include God is an extrapolation in dire need of legitimate justification.

(September 5, 2011 at 8:30 am)Rhythm Wrote: If we were to assume a god exists...

But we were not asked to assume a god exists. We were asked to assume that the God behind the Potter analogy exists.
Man is a rational animal who always loses his temper when
called upon to act in accordance with the dictates of reason.
(Oscar Wilde)
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Messages In This Thread
Potter to the clay - by searchingforanswers - August 29, 2011 at 4:32 pm
RE: Potter to the clay - by The Grand Nudger - August 29, 2011 at 4:34 pm
RE: Potter to the clay - by Violet - August 29, 2011 at 8:29 pm
RE: Potter to the clay - by searchingforanswers - August 29, 2011 at 8:19 pm
RE: Potter to the clay - by The Grand Nudger - August 29, 2011 at 8:20 pm
RE: Potter to the clay - by Epimethean - September 17, 2011 at 1:52 pm
RE: Potter to the clay - by searchingforanswers - August 29, 2011 at 8:23 pm
RE: Potter to the clay - by The Grand Nudger - August 29, 2011 at 8:25 pm
RE: Potter to the clay - by searchingforanswers - August 29, 2011 at 8:27 pm
RE: Potter to the clay - by The Grand Nudger - August 29, 2011 at 8:28 pm
RE: Potter to the clay - by The Grand Nudger - August 29, 2011 at 8:30 pm
RE: Potter to the clay - by Violet - August 29, 2011 at 8:31 pm
RE: Potter to the clay - by searchingforanswers - August 29, 2011 at 8:30 pm
RE: Potter to the clay - by The Grand Nudger - August 29, 2011 at 8:30 pm
RE: Potter to the clay - by The Grand Nudger - August 29, 2011 at 8:37 pm
RE: Potter to the clay - by searchingforanswers - August 29, 2011 at 8:38 pm
RE: Potter to the clay - by The Grand Nudger - August 29, 2011 at 8:42 pm
RE: Potter to the clay - by C Rod - August 29, 2011 at 8:48 pm
RE: Potter to the clay - by The Grand Nudger - August 29, 2011 at 8:50 pm
RE: Potter to the clay - by C Rod - August 29, 2011 at 8:56 pm
RE: Potter to the clay - by The Grand Nudger - August 29, 2011 at 8:58 pm
RE: Potter to the clay - by Minimalist - August 29, 2011 at 9:00 pm
RE: Potter to the clay - by Justtristo - August 30, 2011 at 4:28 am
RE: Potter to the clay - by frankiej - August 30, 2011 at 1:38 pm
RE: Potter to the clay - by Minimalist - August 30, 2011 at 12:33 pm
RE: Potter to the clay - by salty - August 30, 2011 at 1:21 pm
RE: Potter to the clay - by Ace Otana - August 30, 2011 at 1:53 pm
RE: Potter to the clay - by Minimalist - August 30, 2011 at 1:53 pm
RE: Potter to the clay - by salty - August 30, 2011 at 4:15 pm
RE: Potter to the clay - by The Grand Nudger - August 30, 2011 at 4:39 pm
RE: Potter to the clay - by searchingforanswers - August 30, 2011 at 4:51 pm
RE: Potter to the clay - by salty - September 1, 2011 at 5:17 pm
RE: Potter to the clay - by Greatest I am - September 1, 2011 at 2:01 pm
RE: Potter to the clay - by frankiej - September 1, 2011 at 5:21 pm
RE: Potter to the clay - by salty - September 2, 2011 at 5:09 am
RE: Potter to the clay - by frankiej - September 2, 2011 at 6:11 am
RE: Potter to the clay - by The Grand Nudger - September 1, 2011 at 5:22 pm
RE: Potter to the clay - by Ace Otana - September 2, 2011 at 5:42 am
RE: Potter to the clay - by salty - September 2, 2011 at 9:10 am
RE: Potter to the clay - by Ace Otana - September 2, 2011 at 9:47 am
RE: Potter to the clay - by salty - September 2, 2011 at 3:34 pm
RE: Potter to the clay - by Ace Otana - September 2, 2011 at 3:52 pm
RE: Potter to the clay - by KichigaiNeko - September 2, 2011 at 9:14 am
RE: Potter to the clay - by The Grand Nudger - September 2, 2011 at 9:15 am
RE: Potter to the clay - by KichigaiNeko - September 2, 2011 at 9:19 am
RE: Potter to the clay - by Ryft - September 4, 2011 at 10:08 pm
RE: Potter to the clay - by searchingforanswers - September 4, 2011 at 11:20 pm
RE: Potter to the clay - by Ryft - September 5, 2011 at 12:49 am
RE: Potter to the clay - by ElDinero - September 5, 2011 at 7:50 am
RE: Potter to the clay - by Minimalist - September 5, 2011 at 2:07 am
RE: Potter to the clay - by frankiej - September 5, 2011 at 7:57 am
RE: Potter to the clay - by The Grand Nudger - September 5, 2011 at 8:30 am
RE: Potter to the clay - by Ryft - September 5, 2011 at 1:58 pm
RE: Potter to the clay - by frankiej - September 5, 2011 at 2:21 pm
RE: Potter to the clay - by Ryft - September 5, 2011 at 2:52 pm
RE: Potter to the clay - by The Grand Nudger - September 5, 2011 at 2:00 pm
RE: Potter to the clay - by C Rod - September 6, 2011 at 1:59 pm
RE: Potter to the clay - by frankiej - September 5, 2011 at 2:57 pm
RE: Potter to the clay - by The Grand Nudger - September 5, 2011 at 2:59 pm
RE: Potter to the clay - by The Grand Nudger - September 6, 2011 at 2:01 pm
RE: Potter to the clay - by C Rod - September 13, 2011 at 1:16 pm
RE: Potter to the clay - by frankiej - September 13, 2011 at 1:20 pm
RE: Potter to the clay - by Darwinian - September 13, 2011 at 1:29 pm
RE: Potter to the clay - by C Rod - September 13, 2011 at 1:39 pm
RE: Potter to the clay - by frankiej - September 6, 2011 at 2:02 pm
RE: Potter to the clay - by downbeatplumb - September 6, 2011 at 2:13 pm
RE: Potter to the clay - by Darwinian - September 13, 2011 at 1:46 pm
RE: Potter to the clay - by C Rod - September 13, 2011 at 1:50 pm
RE: Potter to the clay - by downbeatplumb - September 13, 2011 at 1:50 pm
RE: Potter to the clay - by Darwinian - September 13, 2011 at 1:53 pm
RE: Potter to the clay - by downbeatplumb - September 13, 2011 at 1:58 pm
RE: Potter to the clay - by Darwinian - September 13, 2011 at 2:02 pm
RE: Potter to the clay - by downbeatplumb - September 13, 2011 at 2:39 pm
RE: Potter to the clay - by frankiej - September 13, 2011 at 2:41 pm
RE: Potter to the clay - by downbeatplumb - September 13, 2011 at 2:51 pm
RE: Potter to the clay - by KichigaiNeko - September 14, 2011 at 5:20 am
RE: Potter to the clay - by lucent - September 16, 2011 at 10:55 pm
RE: Potter to the clay - by frankiej - September 17, 2011 at 9:16 am
RE: Potter to the clay - by The Grand Nudger - September 16, 2011 at 11:07 pm
RE: Potter to the clay - by lucent - September 17, 2011 at 2:21 am
RE: Potter to the clay - by MilesTailsPrower - September 17, 2011 at 12:05 am
RE: Potter to the clay - by FutureAndAHope - September 17, 2011 at 4:12 am
RE: Potter to the clay - by BloodyHeretic - September 17, 2011 at 1:25 pm
RE: Potter to the clay - by searchingforanswers - September 17, 2011 at 2:02 pm
RE: Potter to the clay - by BloodyHeretic - September 17, 2011 at 2:10 pm
RE: Potter to the clay - by lucent - September 18, 2011 at 7:48 am
RE: Potter to the clay - by BloodyHeretic - September 18, 2011 at 8:26 am
RE: Potter to the clay - by lucent - September 18, 2011 at 7:12 pm
RE: Potter to the clay - by Zen Badger - September 18, 2011 at 8:48 am
RE: Potter to the clay - by Darwinian - September 18, 2011 at 7:57 am
RE: Potter to the clay - by frankiej - September 18, 2011 at 3:17 pm
RE: Potter to the clay - by Epimethean - September 18, 2011 at 6:01 pm

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