RE: The Objective Moral Values Argument AGAINST The Existence Of God
May 1, 2018 at 11:41 am
(This post was last modified: May 1, 2018 at 11:44 am by The Grand Nudger.)
(May 1, 2018 at 10:50 am)henryp Wrote: Premise 5 seems to imply there are other rational reasons to believe in objective morality? You never claimed that, and you'd have to for the argument. But again, you'd need someone to accept that, otherwise you'd have to prove other rational reasons exist.
That one's pretty easy. The only contingency of moral realism is that there are moral facts of a matter. With respect to each other, there are only four possible states of affairs...Those are further seperated conceptually (and below) based upon their specific relationship to the existence of objective morality - the existent object in question being pointed to as indicative of something.
If there is a god and there are moral facts of a matter, moral realism is true.
If there is no god and there are moral facts of a matter, moral realism is true.
If there is a god and there are no moral facts of a matter, moral realism is false.
If there is no god and there are no moral facts of a matter, moral realism is false.
This demonstrates that the existence of gods and the existence of moral facts can be dissociated conceptually. They may have an incidental relationship...but it's not a necessary relationship. It also demonstrates that the latter is informative as to the existence of an objective morality, not the former. Conversely, it demonstrates that the acceptance of objective morality is indicative of the existence of moral facts, not gods. As a refutation of divine necessity in moral realism the above is complete before the first example is offered.
In the general, any reason x that........y is wrong, doesn't refer to a god, and is true...........satisfies the conditions for both of the first two possible states.
Let's take a specific example. Skullfucking your neighbor is wrong because it will hurt your neighbor. If that's why skullfucking your neighbor is wrong, it would be equally wrong in the first two possible states and one of them is godless.
I am the Infantry. I am my country’s strength in war, her deterrent in peace. I am the heart of the fight… wherever, whenever. I carry America’s faith and honor against her enemies. I am the Queen of Battle. I am what my country expects me to be, the best trained Soldier in the world. In the race for victory, I am swift, determined, and courageous, armed with a fierce will to win. Never will I fail my country’s trust. Always I fight on…through the foe, to the objective, to triumph overall. If necessary, I will fight to my death. By my steadfast courage, I have won more than 200 years of freedom. I yield not to weakness, to hunger, to cowardice, to fatigue, to superior odds, For I am mentally tough, physically strong, and morally straight. I forsake not, my country, my mission, my comrades, my sacred duty. I am relentless. I am always there, now and forever. I AM THE INFANTRY! FOLLOW ME!
