There are no "Religions of peace".....

[tackattack]

---

I will agree that it is a force of escapism, and the fact that it's a feature is exactly my point. It involves people. It's systemic across infrastructures (whether religious, government, SJW cause, etc.). What you and Brian are implying is that Religion is bad because it's not peaceful, but nothing is. What it amounts to you both saying, when you agree that it's systemic and a feature, is that people are violent, organizations are violent, let's just not have any organizations, let's start with dismantling religion because I don't like it. Let's just be a little more honest here and call a spade a spade. The problem, and solution will be in the individual.

What I disagree with is "feeling like something helps doesn't actually make a thing a force for good. ". Believing that something is the reason for your good informs you that what you're doing is good. Feeling and belief (as well as hope, fear, justice, etc.) are because of, and the cause of, action. I'm aware this isn't always a societal agreed good, but individually, those things we perceive as being a positive sounding board, inform us that we are right (even when we aren't).


To address your point and continue with what I was saying to Gae, It's not the label that holds the power, it's the Belief backed by how we label ourselves and how others label us that does have power. One is subjectively good if their personal subjective morality defines them as a good doer. One is considered socially good when they're morality is followed and aligns with the societal definitions of morality. Example: You could find executions as murder personally but your society accepts that the moral impetus for justice requires it and labels it moral. That person could either believe they're doing good by society or doing good by themselves, and it will inform a belief followed by an action.

Their behaviors come from far more things than we could map, and I'm not aware of it being done successfully yet. The myriad of beliefs and feelings that inform and spur us to action is not just one thing, as your argument implies. Who are you to say that the fact I believe alien's will abduct me if I go to Nevada is keeping me out of Nevada? Can you say it's not the cause? It may not be a reliable belief, or even the most important one, but it still would inform if I held it true.
Bringing it back to religion, such an emotive force (a type of force multiplier as Gae said) as powerful as religion, does have more power than say, a belief that Popsicle are tasty. A powerful force that can make things spiral quickly either god or bad, based on the direction of the organization and the individual.

"It is not the label that holds the power"

I AGREE, stop right there.

If we both agree on that, then the only logical conclusion to be made is that the belief is a mere belief, not a requirement.

If one can be good and do good being a Muslim, or not being a Muslim, and one can do good being a Christian, or not being a Christian, and one can be good being a Jew or not being a Jew, and one can be good being a Buddhist or not being a Buddhist, and one can be good being a Hindu, and not being a Hindu, and one can be good being an atheist, and not being an atheist, that says to me our behaviors are in our genes, not in the labels we assign ourselves,

"Power" so what? Again, the ancient Egyptians truly believed in their gods as much as any current believer does today. But that "power" isn't a real power, it is a false perception that can have the real effect of social grouping. 

If religion and god belief were a requirement for all life to evolve, one would expect to see other life create religions and gods too. If any one religion or god claim were true, one could expect also, to be able to universally demonstrate it as true beyond personal bias,

The only reason religions exist and god claims exist, is because they are nothing more than our species comic book projection of our own qualities in comic book form. They are nothing more than  superstitious politics as a false justification to create excuses to have power over resources,

---

OK I'm content that we found the first part of common ground. If you don't want to discuss the beliefs formed from labels, and their affect to the good of a society, then that's fine. We can also agree, I believe, that me labeling myself as Christian, has no "God give" or otherworldly power to magically make me good. Since you called an all stop, we can rest it there. Happy Friday!