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Free will and the necessary evil
#22
RE: Free will and the necessary evil
(October 30, 2022 at 8:02 pm)LinuxGal Wrote:
(October 30, 2022 at 1:24 pm)Orbit Wrote: The Christian logic is usually along the lines of "God wants you to make a free choice". This runs into trouble under Calvinism, because of predestination, though.

It runs into trouble for the simple reason that if God "wants" something" then he lacks something, and therefore cannot be infinite.

All the big-name theologians I know of (as opposed to modern apologists) agree with you that because God is infinite he cannot be said to want anything. This is standard in classical theology. 

Because God is absolutely unique, it's difficult to talk about him. Even people who understand this generally fall back on human-centered language, with the proviso that in the case of God, the words have different meanings. 

So yes, for those theologians, God does not want anything in the way that people want things. Nor does he love anything in the way that people love things. "Wanting," when used in reference to God, means the things that people can do to move more in the direction of God himself. In this view God is the Form of the Good -- goodness itself -- and so anything we do which is good for us and for others moves us more in that direction. 

Theologians who are stricter about language, in order to avoid misunderstanding, are happy to say that God wants nothing, does nothing, and doesn't exist (in the way that everything else exists).
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Messages In This Thread
Free will and the necessary evil - by Mystical - October 30, 2022 at 11:23 am
RE: Free will and the necessary evil - by zebo-the-fat - October 30, 2022 at 11:36 am
RE: Free will and the necessary evil - by Mystical - October 30, 2022 at 11:43 am
RE: Free will and the necessary evil - by Jehanne - October 30, 2022 at 1:55 pm
RE: Free will and the necessary evil - by Mystical - October 30, 2022 at 2:28 pm
RE: Free will and the necessary evil - by Jehanne - October 30, 2022 at 2:45 pm
RE: Free will and the necessary evil - by Anomalocaris - October 31, 2022 at 1:59 am
RE: Free will and the necessary evil - by Jehanne - October 31, 2022 at 6:36 am
RE: Free will and the necessary evil - by Angrboda - October 30, 2022 at 1:20 pm
RE: Free will and the necessary evil - by Orbit - October 30, 2022 at 1:24 pm
RE: Free will and the necessary evil - by Mystical - October 30, 2022 at 2:28 pm
RE: Free will and the necessary evil - by Angrboda - October 30, 2022 at 3:01 pm
RE: Free will and the necessary evil - by BrianSoddingBoru4 - October 30, 2022 at 3:26 pm
RE: Free will and the necessary evil - by LinuxGal - October 30, 2022 at 8:02 pm
RE: Free will and the necessary evil - by Belacqua - October 31, 2022 at 1:30 am
RE: Free will and the necessary evil - by BrianSoddingBoru4 - October 30, 2022 at 1:45 pm
RE: Free will and the necessary evil - by Jehanne - October 30, 2022 at 4:14 pm
RE: Free will and the necessary evil - by BrianSoddingBoru4 - October 30, 2022 at 5:20 pm
RE: Free will and the necessary evil - by Jehanne - October 30, 2022 at 8:57 pm
RE: Free will and the necessary evil - by LadyForCamus - October 30, 2022 at 9:15 pm
RE: Free will and the necessary evil - by Jehanne - October 30, 2022 at 9:24 pm
RE: Free will and the necessary evil - by Belacqua - October 31, 2022 at 1:23 am
RE: Free will and the necessary evil - by BrianSoddingBoru4 - October 31, 2022 at 4:19 am
RE: Free will and the necessary evil - by Silver - October 30, 2022 at 9:23 pm
RE: Free will and the necessary evil - by Ranjr - October 30, 2022 at 11:27 pm
RE: Free will and the necessary evil - by BrianSoddingBoru4 - October 31, 2022 at 6:42 am
RE: Free will and the necessary evil - by The Grand Nudger - October 31, 2022 at 7:52 am
RE: Free will and the necessary evil - by BrianSoddingBoru4 - October 31, 2022 at 10:59 am
RE: Free will and the necessary evil - by Jehanne - November 1, 2022 at 8:33 am
RE: Free will and the necessary evil - by The Grand Nudger - November 1, 2022 at 8:01 am
RE: Free will and the necessary evil - by Neo-Scholastic - November 1, 2022 at 10:23 am
RE: Free will and the necessary evil - by Jehanne - November 1, 2022 at 12:00 pm
RE: Free will and the necessary evil - by Neo-Scholastic - November 1, 2022 at 5:09 pm
RE: Free will and the necessary evil - by Jehanne - November 1, 2022 at 5:11 pm
RE: Free will and the necessary evil - by Neo-Scholastic - November 1, 2022 at 9:46 pm
RE: Free will and the necessary evil - by Jehanne - November 1, 2022 at 9:58 pm
RE: Free will and the necessary evil - by HankMoody316 - November 2, 2022 at 2:48 pm
RE: Free will and the necessary evil - by BrianSoddingBoru4 - November 2, 2022 at 3:55 pm
RE: Free will and the necessary evil - by LinuxGal - November 2, 2022 at 3:19 pm
RE: Free will and the necessary evil - by HankMoody316 - November 2, 2022 at 11:52 pm
RE: Free will and the necessary evil - by Jehanne - November 3, 2022 at 5:06 am
RE: Free will and the necessary evil - by LinuxGal - November 5, 2022 at 11:08 am
RE: Free will and the necessary evil - by BrianSoddingBoru4 - November 1, 2022 at 12:05 pm
RE: Free will and the necessary evil - by h4ym4n - November 1, 2022 at 10:12 am
RE: Free will and the necessary evil - by Pat Mustard - November 1, 2022 at 10:56 am
RE: Free will and the necessary evil - by The Grand Nudger - November 1, 2022 at 3:43 pm
RE: Free will and the necessary evil - by BrianSoddingBoru4 - November 1, 2022 at 3:57 pm
RE: Free will and the necessary evil - by The Grand Nudger - November 1, 2022 at 10:03 pm
RE: Free will and the necessary evil - by Jehanne - November 2, 2022 at 5:08 pm
RE: Free will and the necessary evil - by Gwaithmir - November 2, 2022 at 8:00 pm
RE: Free will and the necessary evil - by The Grand Nudger - November 2, 2022 at 8:14 pm
RE: Free will and the necessary evil - by Silver - November 2, 2022 at 8:21 pm
RE: Free will and the necessary evil - by Jehanne - November 2, 2022 at 8:31 pm
RE: Free will and the necessary evil - by The Grand Nudger - November 2, 2022 at 11:23 pm
RE: Free will and the necessary evil - by The Grand Nudger - November 3, 2022 at 12:13 am
RE: Free will and the necessary evil - by Silver - November 3, 2022 at 12:15 am
RE: Free will and the necessary evil - by HankMoody316 - November 3, 2022 at 12:56 am
RE: Free will and the necessary evil - by Belacqua - November 3, 2022 at 1:50 am
RE: Free will and the necessary evil - by Angrboda - November 3, 2022 at 8:48 am
RE: Free will and the necessary evil - by Neo-Scholastic - November 3, 2022 at 11:56 pm
RE: Free will and the necessary evil - by Jehanne - November 4, 2022 at 5:56 am
RE: Free will and the necessary evil - by Belacqua - November 4, 2022 at 6:13 am
RE: Free will and the necessary evil - by Jehanne - November 4, 2022 at 6:16 am
RE: Free will and the necessary evil - by Belacqua - November 4, 2022 at 6:33 am
RE: Free will and the necessary evil - by Jehanne - November 4, 2022 at 6:35 am
RE: Free will and the necessary evil - by Belacqua - November 4, 2022 at 6:39 am
RE: Free will and the necessary evil - by Jehanne - November 4, 2022 at 8:16 am
RE: Free will and the necessary evil - by Belacqua - November 4, 2022 at 8:28 am
RE: Free will and the necessary evil - by Jehanne - November 4, 2022 at 8:33 am
RE: Free will and the necessary evil - by Belacqua - November 4, 2022 at 8:38 am
RE: Free will and the necessary evil - by Jehanne - November 4, 2022 at 8:54 am
RE: Free will and the necessary evil - by Belacqua - November 4, 2022 at 9:10 am
RE: Free will and the necessary evil - by Jehanne - November 4, 2022 at 9:26 am
RE: Free will and the necessary evil - by Angrboda - November 4, 2022 at 9:39 am
RE: Free will and the necessary evil - by Jehanne - November 4, 2022 at 10:00 am
RE: Free will and the necessary evil - by Angrboda - November 4, 2022 at 10:48 am
RE: Free will and the necessary evil - by Jehanne - November 4, 2022 at 11:36 am
RE: Free will and the necessary evil - by Angrboda - November 4, 2022 at 12:23 pm
RE: Free will and the necessary evil - by Jehanne - November 4, 2022 at 12:44 pm
RE: Free will and the necessary evil - by Angrboda - November 4, 2022 at 2:31 pm
RE: Free will and the necessary evil - by Jehanne - November 4, 2022 at 2:51 pm
RE: Free will and the necessary evil - by Angrboda - November 5, 2022 at 10:32 am
RE: Free will and the necessary evil - by LinuxGal - November 5, 2022 at 10:46 am
RE: Free will and the necessary evil - by Jehanne - November 5, 2022 at 12:48 pm
RE: Free will and the necessary evil - by Angrboda - November 5, 2022 at 12:58 pm
RE: Free will and the necessary evil - by Jehanne - November 5, 2022 at 1:14 pm
RE: Free will and the necessary evil - by Angrboda - November 5, 2022 at 4:44 pm
RE: Free will and the necessary evil - by Jehanne - November 5, 2022 at 5:00 pm
RE: Free will and the necessary evil - by Angrboda - November 5, 2022 at 5:15 pm
RE: Free will and the necessary evil - by Jehanne - November 5, 2022 at 5:57 pm
RE: Free will and the necessary evil - by Angrboda - November 5, 2022 at 8:07 pm
RE: Free will and the necessary evil - by Jehanne - November 5, 2022 at 8:23 pm
RE: Free will and the necessary evil - by LinuxGal - November 5, 2022 at 6:20 pm
RE: Free will and the necessary evil - by LinuxGal - December 16, 2022 at 8:36 pm
RE: Free will and the necessary evil - by Jehanne - December 16, 2022 at 9:17 pm
RE: Free will and the necessary evil - by HankMoody316 - November 6, 2022 at 3:00 am
RE: Free will and the necessary evil - by Belacqua - November 6, 2022 at 3:08 am
RE: Free will and the necessary evil - by HankMoody316 - November 6, 2022 at 3:21 am
RE: Free will and the necessary evil - by Belacqua - November 6, 2022 at 3:45 am
RE: Free will and the necessary evil - by Jehanne - November 6, 2022 at 6:53 am
RE: Free will and the necessary evil - by Nay_Sayer - November 6, 2022 at 2:05 pm
RE: Free will and the necessary evil - by HankMoody316 - November 6, 2022 at 4:35 pm
RE: Free will and the necessary evil - by Belacqua - November 6, 2022 at 7:24 pm
RE: Free will and the necessary evil - by Nay_Sayer - November 6, 2022 at 2:04 pm
RE: Free will and the necessary evil - by HankMoody316 - November 6, 2022 at 4:44 pm
RE: Free will and the necessary evil - by Nay_Sayer - November 6, 2022 at 5:49 pm
RE: Free will and the necessary evil - by The Grand Nudger - November 3, 2022 at 12:20 am
RE: Free will and the necessary evil - by Silver - November 3, 2022 at 12:40 am
RE: Free will and the necessary evil - by The Grand Nudger - November 3, 2022 at 1:08 am
RE: Free will and the necessary evil - by HankMoody316 - November 3, 2022 at 1:41 am
RE: Free will and the necessary evil - by BrianSoddingBoru4 - November 3, 2022 at 4:37 am
RE: Free will and the necessary evil - by arewethereyet - November 3, 2022 at 2:00 pm
RE: Free will and the necessary evil - by Ranjr - November 3, 2022 at 9:01 am
RE: Free will and the necessary evil - by purplepurpose - November 3, 2022 at 2:27 pm
RE: Free will and the necessary evil - by The Grand Nudger - November 4, 2022 at 8:49 am
RE: Free will and the necessary evil - by Ahriman - November 4, 2022 at 10:57 am
RE: Free will and the necessary evil - by BrianSoddingBoru4 - November 4, 2022 at 11:02 am
RE: Free will and the necessary evil - by The Grand Nudger - November 4, 2022 at 12:43 pm
RE: Free will and the necessary evil - by The Grand Nudger - November 4, 2022 at 12:59 pm
RE: Free will and the necessary evil - by Jehanne - November 4, 2022 at 1:02 pm
RE: Free will and the necessary evil - by arewethereyet - November 4, 2022 at 2:54 pm
RE: Free will and the necessary evil - by Jehanne - November 4, 2022 at 2:57 pm
RE: Free will and the necessary evil - by Ahriman - November 4, 2022 at 5:13 pm
RE: Free will and the necessary evil - by LadyForCamus - November 4, 2022 at 6:03 pm
RE: Free will and the necessary evil - by Ranjr - November 5, 2022 at 12:40 am
RE: Free will and the necessary evil - by LinuxGal - November 5, 2022 at 10:12 am
RE: Free will and the necessary evil - by Ranjr - November 6, 2022 at 2:20 pm
RE: Free will and the necessary evil - by The Grand Nudger - November 6, 2022 at 2:45 pm
RE: Free will and the necessary evil - by Ranjr - November 6, 2022 at 8:27 pm
RE: Free will and the necessary evil - by arewethereyet - November 6, 2022 at 8:18 pm

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