Lee Strobel?

[Godscreated]

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To Godschild: Umm, I had 30 years for God to prove that he's real, technically 42 years. I was a better believer than most. I had a solid belief in god. He was very real to me.

For 3 decades I couldn't understand Atheists. How could they not have the ability to believe? Why was this so? Some of these people had eagerly sought god at one point in their lives and did not find him. How could they not have found him, yet I did? If they could only see what I saw, be able to experience what I experienced then they would believe....if only. It made no sense to me why they couldn't do this.

For most people I knew I could not chalk any of the cause for their unbelief on a simple desire to live in sin and debauchery. I noted time and again that those without god often had better ethics. Yes some of them drank beer and or lived in sin with their girlfriends but, unlike a lot of the god fearing Christians I knew, they weren't assholes. What made the Christians assholes was often the religion. Religion produced ambitions and opportunities to abuse others that did not exist in the non Christian world. For example, I remember when my family and I had to move out of state and needed some help putting things on the moving van. Though I had helpped some members of my church move, these same people were unavailable when I needed their help. The non Christians were the ones who helped. Little things like this are common when you are a Christian. And to answer your next question Godschild, don't give me that bullshit response "well it doesn't happen in my church because ________"(enter excuse in the blank). Unless you've lived under a rock or are new to the faith you've seen the bullshit yourself.

As for blame. Perhaps the real blame lies in the religion itself. If it wasn't bullshit it would be able to prove itself to not be bullshit. This sort of leaves people like Lee Strobel off the hook.....sort of. They are doing the best they can with what they have. I couldn't accept their arguments and was embarrassed by their stupidity. This kept me looking, I just didn't find what I thought I'd find. I guess this is where the saying "you can't create something out of nothing" sort of works. You can't make something real that wasn't real in the first place.

As for Apostasy, it was mind boggling to me. Why would anyone who has known the father choose to leave? I could understand why someone would leave the religion. There's a lot of abuse and assholes there. I felt bad for those who had to leave because of abuse. I could also understand those who left because they wanted to drink and fool around. I couldn't understand those people who didn't leave out of hurt and bitterness or a desire to follow carnal desires. It's like god just evaporated from their lives. Now I find myself in their shoes. It's a weird situation.

One more thing. Brain science and psychology has done a lot to explain why people experience or seem to experience "spiritual" phenomena. I'm working my way through this stuff. So far science has answered more questions than 30 years of Christianity has done. Furthermore science is provable and reproducible. It's a lot more reliable way to explain spiritual phenomena than religion.

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Let's get one thing out of the way, I understand how you felt. I've done things for many in my church and have not received help when I needed it and not only does it seem wrong, it is wrong. Now to be truthful I've done the same thing. There are verses in scripture that says to trust in man (christian or not) will lead to disappointment, you and I have both experienced this. As a christian I must rely on God who is always faithful. In your move when no one from your church would help you can you be sure that God did not send non christians to help you. If you know scripture well then you know God said he will work good through those that believe and those who do not believe. Could be that God was faithful to you and like me you did not recognize that he did. To often christians get caught up in their troubles and not realize God is with us. A christians main focus should always be God and allow him to do through us what he wants to do for others and by what you have said you were doing that. I don't know but maybe you were the better christian in your church and they needed you as their example, God could have called you to that very work, did you ever consider that possibility. I know he has used me in some ways that I would have never chosen myself for but, I did realize after a while what was happening and knew God was not only active in my life but chose me to do certain works through. To this very day I have no idea why, other than it pleased him. In doing so he made me look good, which I'm not, and brought glory to himself through me, I do not know what could be greater in my life than that. The problem with a lot of christians is they treat christianity like a religion and make something out of it it's not.
I also have problems understanding why people would turn away from God. I do understand those who only played the role to be accepted. I also think I understand those who want to live by the Law of Moses and make themselves better for God instead of allowing Christ to work through them and make them who he knows they can be. They soon get discouraged with trying to do the impossible and leave the church. Now for those who have been faithful for years and walked with God and turn their backs on God, well I do not know if I can ever understand those. What I do know is to turn from God because of others is crazy, I'm guilty of that and regret what I did. As I have said before science trying to explain the spiritual life is useless as anything could be. Science needs God to be a phenomena, if it's to survive as it is today. Science and God can go hand in hand, I'm not against science I like it and enjoy many things I've learned through it.