Jaysus effin' Christ!! Santorum on abortion due to rape

[Erinome]

Too bad they can't transfer the fetus into the man. Ever carried a baby to term?

The drama team can stop acting like I said anyone should be forced to do anything and read it the way it was written -- father's rights should have some consideration.

Deflection is cheap.

Now, my ever carrying a baby to term is irrelevent.

Of course it is.

I don't need a list of potential side effects. I'm a 29-year-old women with five sisters, nine nieces and nephews and a midwife for a sister. I understand you consider yourself an expert on the topic and you certainly know something of it. However, I'm talking about opinions on parent's rights, not forcing people to carry babies.

I consider myself an expert on the topic of women's reproductive rights. There is a reason the father has no rights to an unborn, and isn't even given the luxury of any sort of discussion about the fate of a fetus. The main reason is there is no way to prove the paternity of the fetus before 10 weeks, and even that requires a pretty risky procedure called an amniocentesis. There are risks to both mother and fetus with that, as well. I've had one of them done, for a different reason, and it was not pleasant.

The father can have an opinion all he wants, but it doesn't matter because it's not his body.

Furthermore, those are potential side effects. Many women carry babies with no permanent damage. Both of my grandmothers had ten children and one died of an aneurism and the other of cancer. Both died as old women. Hmmmm . . .

So because they're just potential side effects it's no big deal? No such thing as a woman who carries a baby to term and doesn't suffer permanent damage. I don't know what kind of dream world you're living in, but every woman has, at the very least her hips displaced from their natural position. They never go back. Might not seem like a big deal to such an easy going person, like yourself, but some women are very bothered by that. I can also assure you that pushing out a baby you didn't want because the father wants it does , and will cause permanent damage.

This is all irrelevant. When I say, make little girls carry babies to term against their will, you can educate me on the ills of that. The bottom line is that I never said women should be "forced" to carry to term. I certainly never said girls should.

It's a slippery slope from allowing fathers to be in on the "discussion", and forcing women to adhere to their stated wishes in those discussions.

Yeah, because I said all of that. Give it a rest for fuck's sake.

Why are you being a bitch? I was trying to explain to you why men don't get a say on the matter. If you think the majority of those sperm donors aren't pieces of shit, you're jaded beyond belief. I know you're married to your poorly informed opinion, but I was trying to shed some light from an insider's point-of-view. Excuse the fucking hell outta me.

To paraphrase what I said, if a man wants to keep the kid and is willing to let the mother sign over parents rights and not help . . . there should be some discussion.

And I told you why that was a load of stinking bullshit. If he's willing to be so wonderfully kind as to allow her to sign over her rights because he wants to keep the child??? Oh that makes it sooo much better! If she is willing to do that, then it's all good, but you're still not getting the point, obviously. That statement is actually pretty gross. If I didn't know better, I would think you were a male chauvinist, like mehmet or something.

If she isn't ready to have a child, she can give it to the father.

What part of she doesn't want to be pregnant and have the baby don't you get? When men can get pregnant, they can make their own decisions about what happens to their body.

I realize it is a pet habit for extremist to go, "Holy fuck! You're a woman and you want 12-year-olds to carry rapist's babies!" and other such nonsense. However, I am relatively certain you have the mental capacity to realize that is not at all what I said, Alei.

An extremist? I didn't say you said you want 12 year olds to carry their rapist's babies. I said it was a stupid fucking idea to allow the fathers of fetuses to make decisions about someone else's body. It is a stupid, stupid idea. He may be free to express his opinion, but he doesn't, and shouldn't have any right to enforce it. Whether it be that she wants to keep the baby, or abort it. He has no official say for reasons.

Also, you are presenting all men as ball scratching beer drinkers. Yeah, I'm relatively certain that is not what my father did when I was born.

Nope. What I was saying is that men don't have to do a damn thing to become a father. I was saying that men don't have a say because it's the woman who has to endure the physical traumas associated with pregnancy. He can drink beer. Not that he would drink beer. She can't, but what if she did? What a horrible person that bitch would be. She's an alcoholic who doesn't want to stop drinking, so she wants to have an abortion, but the father wants the baby. Does he want a baby with fetal alcohol syndrome? Should we allow him to decide if she gets to drink alcohol or not too? Should we even allow him in on the discussion? Fuck no. It's not his body. He doesn't have to change his entire life when he doesn't want to, and neither should a woman, just because he's sentimental.

Yeah, because that is how it always goes down. What is it with people on the extreme ends of this debate? They could have agreed to get pregnant and then she flakes. Has that never happened where you work or is only just Christian teen mothers and girls whose boyfriends sat outside scratching their balls and getting drunk while their girlfriend had an abortion? They're all victims? Bullshit!

That was ignorant. Even if she agrees to get pregnant, and then flakes, that is still her right. And no, that's never happened. Some of them are Muslim, some are hookers, some are rape victims, some are 30 year old women who just don't want to be a mother, and had an accident. I don't care if the father is a fucking saint, his opinion is irrelevant for the many, many reasons I stated above. I am presenting you with the truth when I say that most of the girls getting abortions are Christian teens. That means the majority. Not all. Those girls are victims of poor sexual education, and if you don't want to acknowledge that, it's your problem. Some people like to be enlightened, some people value being right over accepting the truth.

And . . . again . . . I have never said women should be forced to carry a baby. I am saying there should be an option for her to sign over parental rights to the father at birth to make it possible for a man to get full custody of a baby a mom does not want right at birth. I know, it's so evil of me.

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Mothers do have the right to sign over parental rights to the father if they don't want the baby. And like I said, it's a slippery slope.

Oh, and this demands comment. The fruits of a woman's womb for whatever reason? What are you a uterine supremacist? You need sperm too. And . . . how about so he can have his child? Whatever reason? Seriously. I don't want to speculate, but I can only assume your dad isn't the cat's meow. I just can't understand why you would minimize a father's role in a child's life so much. It baffles me. My dad is the fucking man.

A uterine supremacist? No, sweetheart, I'm not. I'm a compassionate person who talks to women in crisis for a living. Him having his child is not important if the woman doesn't want to go through the intensive invasion of her body so he can have a baby and be a daddy. You're really cold about this whole thing, and you don't know what it feels like to be 8 months pregnant when you don't want to be. I do. So if you think that I am standing up for women, you're damn right I am. You don't have my permission to make me feel like shit about that. You might have sisters who've gone through it, and a midwife whatever, but until you go through it, you can't really know.

Some people don't even have to go through it because they have empathy. If you had empathy, none of this garbage could come out of your mouth.

Asking me about my father? Fuck you. The only daddy I ever had tied me up to chairs and urinated on me. He was good to the kids that were made from his sperm. I'm so glad you have a swell father, but I don't know if you've noticed or not, from inside your bubble, but there is an epidemic in this country of absent/shitty fathers. To act like I could only understand a father's plight just because I don't have a father is pretty fucking rich coming from someone who has shown literally no empathy for what women have to go through during and after pregnancy.