The Surahs in the Quran all begin with "In the name of God, the Compassionate, the Merciful".
There is so much emphasis by Islam that God is Merciful and Compassionate. His Mercy is said to encompass all things in one verse.
I was going to post this in the Islam forum, but I think this discussion can encompass Christians as well.
In Quran intense torture is promised to the following people:
1: Those whom take another god besides the one true god
2: Those whom disbelieve in revelations/guidance of God
3: Those whom desire the life of this world
4: Those whom do not believe in God's revelation/guidance/signs
Now I don't see how it all God can be deemed compassionate and merciful, when he will not only punish these people, which includes majority of human beings, but he will torture them.
If he was compassionate to human beings, how can he torture a person for beliefs? Also, isn't nature to desire the life of this world, so how can a Compassionate Merciful being promise hell fire to such a natural thing.
I think the idea of this God is not remotely close to being Compassionate or Merciful.
The same is true of Christian concept of hell. If we don't believe in the bible, which has no conclusive evidence for it, we end up in hell. The same logic applies. How is this at all a Merciful God.
I don't think anyone ever brags about God torturing people. No one will say God is so great he is going to put all disbelievers of his religion in hell-fire.
When people want to magnify their concept of God, they will bring how merciful he is to accept repentance no matter what the sin is. How much God loves people. Things like that.
This tells me, people intuitively don't admire the unmerciful avenging attributes attributed to God by Christians and Muslims.
I also don't know what to make of Christians saying God loves everyone, yet is going to torture so many people for disbelieving in the bible.
This is not withstanding that people whom disbelieve in religion or God, can be good people. For sake of argument, let's say doing this makes you a bad person.
Should that person be tortured? As human beings should we want such people to be tortured? Or is it an ugly trait to want people to be tortured.
Please no one reply with but God wants to save you, you just have to accept. I'm talking about wanting people whom die as disbelievers to be tortured. Should we want that?
In Islam, it's emphasized God is Most Merciful. But I think human beings in general are more merciful then what has been portrayed of him in both Islam and Christianity.
Although I use to admire the image portrayed by Islam, I think it's a horrific concept of a deity. The same I feel about the Christian concept.
I feel everyone wants to emphasize on the Merciful aspect, like, God is so loving he sent his son to save us from torture. But ignore the flip side of that, why is he torturing people, why does he need to kill his son to save people...they want to emphasize the small speck of beauty of love and compassionate in midst of overwhelming ugliness and brutality.
I don't mean to offend Muslims or Christians, I know from their perception, I'm insulting God...but this is really how I feel...
I worshiped this image of God for most of my life...but I feel I was blinded to how ugly and brutal this image of God really is by a bias I had and other factors in life.
One of things I think that opened my mind was discussing with people that didn't believe in hell.
One of the things is this idea makes you really think bad about disbelievers - that they are so evil and unjust- that they deserve a horrific torture forever.
Doesn't this concept of God feel primitive?
There is so much emphasis by Islam that God is Merciful and Compassionate. His Mercy is said to encompass all things in one verse.
I was going to post this in the Islam forum, but I think this discussion can encompass Christians as well.
In Quran intense torture is promised to the following people:
1: Those whom take another god besides the one true god
2: Those whom disbelieve in revelations/guidance of God
3: Those whom desire the life of this world
4: Those whom do not believe in God's revelation/guidance/signs
Now I don't see how it all God can be deemed compassionate and merciful, when he will not only punish these people, which includes majority of human beings, but he will torture them.
If he was compassionate to human beings, how can he torture a person for beliefs? Also, isn't nature to desire the life of this world, so how can a Compassionate Merciful being promise hell fire to such a natural thing.
I think the idea of this God is not remotely close to being Compassionate or Merciful.
The same is true of Christian concept of hell. If we don't believe in the bible, which has no conclusive evidence for it, we end up in hell. The same logic applies. How is this at all a Merciful God.
I don't think anyone ever brags about God torturing people. No one will say God is so great he is going to put all disbelievers of his religion in hell-fire.
When people want to magnify their concept of God, they will bring how merciful he is to accept repentance no matter what the sin is. How much God loves people. Things like that.
This tells me, people intuitively don't admire the unmerciful avenging attributes attributed to God by Christians and Muslims.
I also don't know what to make of Christians saying God loves everyone, yet is going to torture so many people for disbelieving in the bible.
This is not withstanding that people whom disbelieve in religion or God, can be good people. For sake of argument, let's say doing this makes you a bad person.
Should that person be tortured? As human beings should we want such people to be tortured? Or is it an ugly trait to want people to be tortured.
Please no one reply with but God wants to save you, you just have to accept. I'm talking about wanting people whom die as disbelievers to be tortured. Should we want that?
In Islam, it's emphasized God is Most Merciful. But I think human beings in general are more merciful then what has been portrayed of him in both Islam and Christianity.
Although I use to admire the image portrayed by Islam, I think it's a horrific concept of a deity. The same I feel about the Christian concept.
I feel everyone wants to emphasize on the Merciful aspect, like, God is so loving he sent his son to save us from torture. But ignore the flip side of that, why is he torturing people, why does he need to kill his son to save people...they want to emphasize the small speck of beauty of love and compassionate in midst of overwhelming ugliness and brutality.
I don't mean to offend Muslims or Christians, I know from their perception, I'm insulting God...but this is really how I feel...
I worshiped this image of God for most of my life...but I feel I was blinded to how ugly and brutal this image of God really is by a bias I had and other factors in life.
One of things I think that opened my mind was discussing with people that didn't believe in hell.
One of the things is this idea makes you really think bad about disbelievers - that they are so evil and unjust- that they deserve a horrific torture forever.
Doesn't this concept of God feel primitive?
