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FallentoReason 2.0
#7
RE: FallentoReason 2.0
Quote:When I see a tv or a guitar I presuppose that there was a designer, but maybe this isn't true of things in nature.

The problem is that we, as humans, tend to project human features (like intentionality or emotions) on the world. We do it all the time. We get angry at our TV when it doesn't work, even though the TV doesn't have the intention to work or not, so getting angry at it is (logically speaking) pointless. We said the our car "died on us", even though cars can't die (they're not alive). We have feelings for inanimate objects (a favorite pen, or dress, etc.) that obviously can't reciprocate. We get depressed in a rainy day, and we call it "horrible weather" even though it's only horrible for us. If we were toads, we'd probably love rain with Spanish passion.

My point is that the feeling of design is an emotional response, not a rational one. Is it possible that the universe was designed for us? Maybe. But evidence suggests that we were designed by the universe and for the universe, through evolution and selection.

We're like a sentient puddle, that marvels at how carefully constructed the ground is, just with the right hole that fits her perfectly, when it's the puddle that adapted to the hole.

Quote:Maybe it's just my cognitive functions toying with me and leading me to rationally believe there is a Creator.

It's an emotional response, it's common to every human being and we do it all time. We just have to be careful not to confuse our good emotional response to what goes well in the universe (and conversely, our bad emotional response for what doesn't go so well) with a rational need for an intelligent or orderly creator.

Quote:Do I believe there is a higher order of natural processes which are currently beyond the our understanding? Yes, I do.

The "order" we find in the nature is our attempt to understand processes in a rational way. We construct rules that explain phenomena, but those rules are bound to be changed when we encounter new phenomena. The universe actually doesn't follow an "order" external to it, it just has some features from which the "order" arises. Science is a tentative descriptions of those features.

Sure, we can discover new phenomena, and maybe there are some phenomena that we'll never be able to fully describe, but this do'esnt tell us much about the universe. It tells a lot about our cognitive limits. Anyway, we're good enough to understand how most features of the parts of universe that we usually experience, so even if there's something elusive and impossible to understand, it doesn't interact with our existance too frequently.
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Messages In This Thread
FallentoReason 2.0 - by FallentoReason - November 21, 2012 at 7:59 am
RE: FallentoReason 2.0 - by KichigaiNeko - November 21, 2012 at 8:08 am
RE: FallentoReason 2.0 - by Zen Badger - November 21, 2012 at 8:45 am
RE: FallentoReason 2.0 - by Whateverist - November 21, 2012 at 8:47 am
RE: FallentoReason 2.0 - by FallentoReason - November 24, 2012 at 9:51 pm
RE: FallentoReason 2.0 - by Ben Davis - November 26, 2012 at 8:53 am
RE: FallentoReason 2.0 - by Ben Davis - November 21, 2012 at 9:01 am
RE: FallentoReason 2.0 - by genkaus - November 21, 2012 at 11:03 am
RE: FallentoReason 2.0 - by FallentoReason - November 24, 2012 at 10:04 pm
RE: FallentoReason 2.0 - by Kirbmarc - November 21, 2012 at 11:13 am
RE: FallentoReason 2.0 - by Whateverist - November 21, 2012 at 1:04 pm
RE: FallentoReason 2.0 - by Minimalist - November 24, 2012 at 10:02 pm
RE: FallentoReason 2.0 - by Faith No More - November 25, 2012 at 12:02 am
RE: FallentoReason 2.0 - by Whateverist - November 25, 2012 at 4:50 am
RE: FallentoReason 2.0 - by Norfolk And Chance - November 26, 2012 at 8:49 pm
RE: FallentoReason 2.0 - by Whateverist - November 26, 2012 at 9:32 pm
RE: FallentoReason 2.0 - by DeistPaladin - December 4, 2012 at 5:04 pm
RE: FallentoReason 2.0 - by SpecUVdust - November 26, 2012 at 10:17 pm
RE: FallentoReason 2.0 - by SpecUVdust - November 27, 2012 at 11:02 pm
RE: FallentoReason 2.0 - by overlord fombax - November 28, 2012 at 4:00 am
RE: FallentoReason 2.0 - by FallentoReason - December 3, 2012 at 12:01 pm
RE: FallentoReason 2.0 - by Kirbmarc - December 3, 2012 at 2:16 pm
RE: FallentoReason 2.0 - by FallentoReason - December 4, 2012 at 11:00 am
RE: FallentoReason 2.0 - by SpecUVdust - December 4, 2012 at 3:29 pm
RE: FallentoReason 2.0 - by Kirbmarc - December 4, 2012 at 4:58 pm
RE: FallentoReason 2.0 - by DeistPaladin - December 4, 2012 at 9:32 pm
RE: FallentoReason 2.0 - by Lion IRC - December 4, 2012 at 10:45 pm
RE: FallentoReason 2.0 - by Brunitski - December 4, 2012 at 11:39 pm
RE: FallentoReason 2.0 - by Kirbmarc - December 5, 2012 at 4:46 am
RE: FallentoReason 2.0 - by pocaracas - December 5, 2012 at 6:14 am
RE: FallentoReason 2.0 - by FallentoReason - December 6, 2012 at 10:27 am
RE: FallentoReason 2.0 - by Norfolk And Chance - December 6, 2012 at 9:32 pm
RE: FallentoReason 2.0 - by FallentoReason - December 6, 2012 at 11:23 pm
RE: FallentoReason 2.0 - by The Grand Nudger - December 6, 2012 at 9:38 pm
RE: FallentoReason 2.0 - by jonb - December 6, 2012 at 9:51 pm
RE: FallentoReason 2.0 - by DeistPaladin - December 7, 2012 at 9:42 am
RE: FallentoReason 2.0 - by SpecUVdust - December 6, 2012 at 11:54 pm
RE: FallentoReason 2.0 - by FallentoReason - December 7, 2012 at 12:08 am
RE: FallentoReason 2.0 - by Kirbmarc - December 7, 2012 at 6:25 am
RE: FallentoReason 2.0 - by SpecUVdust - December 7, 2012 at 12:37 am
RE: FallentoReason 2.0 - by FallentoReason - December 7, 2012 at 2:30 am
RE: FallentoReason 2.0 - by pgrimes15 - December 7, 2012 at 8:15 am
RE: FallentoReason 2.0 - by The Grand Nudger - December 7, 2012 at 3:04 am
RE: FallentoReason 2.0 - by FallentoReason - December 7, 2012 at 3:46 am
RE: FallentoReason 2.0 - by The Grand Nudger - December 7, 2012 at 11:05 am
RE: FallentoReason 2.0 - by DeistPaladin - December 7, 2012 at 11:20 am
RE: FallentoReason 2.0 - by FallentoReason - December 9, 2012 at 3:31 am
RE: FallentoReason 2.0 - by The Grand Nudger - December 7, 2012 at 11:35 am
RE: FallentoReason 2.0 - by DeistPaladin - December 7, 2012 at 2:21 pm
RE: FallentoReason 2.0 - by The Grand Nudger - December 7, 2012 at 2:33 pm
RE: FallentoReason 2.0 - by SpecUVdust - December 9, 2012 at 11:23 am
RE: FallentoReason 2.0 - by The Grand Nudger - December 9, 2012 at 12:27 pm
RE: FallentoReason 2.0 - by FallentoReason - December 9, 2012 at 8:59 pm
RE: FallentoReason 2.0 - by pocaracas - December 9, 2012 at 9:16 pm
RE: FallentoReason 2.0 - by Norfolk And Chance - December 9, 2012 at 9:26 pm
RE: FallentoReason 2.0 - by SpecUVdust - December 9, 2012 at 12:31 pm
RE: FallentoReason 2.0 - by FallentoReason - December 9, 2012 at 7:58 pm
RE: FallentoReason 2.0 - by FallentoReason - December 10, 2012 at 12:08 am
RE: FallentoReason 2.0 - by SpecUVdust - December 10, 2012 at 12:29 am
RE: FallentoReason 2.0 - by FallentoReason - December 13, 2012 at 7:50 am
RE: FallentoReason 2.0 - by SpecUVdust - December 13, 2012 at 9:12 am
RE: FallentoReason 2.0 - by The Grand Nudger - December 10, 2012 at 2:07 am
RE: FallentoReason 2.0 - by FallentoReason - December 13, 2012 at 9:00 am
RE: FallentoReason 2.0 - by Norfolk And Chance - December 13, 2012 at 9:04 am
RE: FallentoReason 2.0 - by FallentoReason - December 13, 2012 at 9:09 am
RE: FallentoReason 2.0 - by FallentoReason - December 13, 2012 at 9:17 am
RE: FallentoReason 2.0 - by Jackalope - December 16, 2012 at 1:13 am
RE: FallentoReason 2.0 - by FallentoReason - December 16, 2012 at 1:45 am
RE: FallentoReason 2.0 - by Jackalope - December 16, 2012 at 2:14 am
RE: FallentoReason 2.0 - by SpecUVdust - December 13, 2012 at 9:32 am
RE: FallentoReason 2.0 - by FallentoReason - December 13, 2012 at 9:38 am
RE: FallentoReason 2.0 - by SpecUVdust - December 13, 2012 at 9:57 am
RE: FallentoReason 2.0 - by FallentoReason - December 13, 2012 at 10:26 am
RE: FallentoReason 2.0 - by The Grand Nudger - December 13, 2012 at 11:18 am
RE: FallentoReason 2.0 - by FallentoReason - December 13, 2012 at 12:05 pm
RE: FallentoReason 2.0 - by SpecUVdust - December 13, 2012 at 12:50 pm
RE: FallentoReason 2.0 - by FallentoReason - December 13, 2012 at 10:56 pm
RE: FallentoReason 2.0 - by SpecUVdust - December 15, 2012 at 1:23 am
RE: FallentoReason 2.0 - by SpecUVdust - December 15, 2012 at 1:44 pm
RE: FallentoReason 2.0 - by FallentoReason - December 15, 2012 at 2:02 pm
RE: FallentoReason 2.0 - by SpecUVdust - December 15, 2012 at 2:14 pm
RE: FallentoReason 2.0 - by FallentoReason - December 15, 2012 at 2:18 pm
RE: FallentoReason 2.0 - by SpecUVdust - December 15, 2012 at 2:23 pm
RE: FallentoReason 2.0 - by FallentoReason - December 15, 2012 at 10:18 pm
RE: FallentoReason 2.0 - by The Grand Nudger - December 15, 2012 at 11:07 pm
RE: FallentoReason 2.0 - by SpecUVdust - December 16, 2012 at 1:07 am
RE: FallentoReason 2.0 - by FallentoReason - December 16, 2012 at 1:10 am
RE: FallentoReason 2.0 - by Gambit - December 16, 2012 at 1:50 am
RE: FallentoReason 2.0 - by Jackalope - December 16, 2012 at 2:27 am
RE: FallentoReason 2.0 - by FallentoReason - December 16, 2012 at 4:17 am
RE: FallentoReason 2.0 - by Jackalope - December 16, 2012 at 4:23 am
RE: FallentoReason 2.0 - by FallentoReason - December 16, 2012 at 5:41 am
RE: FallentoReason 2.0 - by FallentoReason - December 16, 2012 at 2:24 am
RE: FallentoReason 2.0 - by SpecUVdust - December 16, 2012 at 2:58 am
RE: FallentoReason 2.0 - by Jackalope - December 16, 2012 at 3:08 am
RE: FallentoReason 2.0 - by SpecUVdust - December 16, 2012 at 3:10 am
RE: FallentoReason 2.0 - by SpecUVdust - December 16, 2012 at 5:03 am
RE: FallentoReason 2.0 - by Norfolk And Chance - December 16, 2012 at 8:19 am
RE: FallentoReason 2.0 - by The Grand Nudger - December 16, 2012 at 10:26 am
RE: FallentoReason 2.0 - by SpecUVdust - December 16, 2012 at 1:39 pm
RE: FallentoReason 2.0 - by FallentoReason - December 20, 2012 at 11:52 am
RE: FallentoReason 2.0 - by SpecUVdust - December 16, 2012 at 6:08 pm
RE: FallentoReason 2.0 - by SpecUVdust - December 23, 2012 at 4:06 am



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