There's no evidence that our choices are free whether determinism or indeterminism is true. If everything is determined then our choices aren't truly "free", they're free in the compatibilist sense but that's another matter of what you consider "free" or not. And in indeterminism, the fact that choices are not determined does not give you control. Your will itself is not "free", if it has more randomness. A lottery doesn't have free choice, and how exactly does awareness give it (like Adrian said). Being conscious of our choices is not the same of having free control over them.
Yes you make choices and decisions Void, we all do, but how are they free?
As I have said many a time on this thread now, I'm not questioning whether we have choices or decisions - I'm questioning whether they're "free" or not . I see no reason to believe that they are and have no evidence that they are, how are they "free", and how can they be? What makes them exempt from the natural process? How does consciousness of our choices make any difference to them being "free" or not?
And no Void, however semantic my argument is, that does not automatically imply that my argument is flawed. And I can always have a go at expressing it again, it I fail to get my position expressed well that doesn't mean my conclusion is false, and I can always try again to clarify it.
And, for the record, I did not buncher a concept at all. Free will is indeed about whether our wills are free or not. You speak of whether we have freedom, over out own choices and decisions. But that's the same thing, whether we have freedom over our will or not, whether our "Will" is "Free" or not.
EvF
Yes you make choices and decisions Void, we all do, but how are they free?
As I have said many a time on this thread now, I'm not questioning whether we have choices or decisions - I'm questioning whether they're "free" or not . I see no reason to believe that they are and have no evidence that they are, how are they "free", and how can they be? What makes them exempt from the natural process? How does consciousness of our choices make any difference to them being "free" or not?
And no Void, however semantic my argument is, that does not automatically imply that my argument is flawed. And I can always have a go at expressing it again, it I fail to get my position expressed well that doesn't mean my conclusion is false, and I can always try again to clarify it.
And, for the record, I did not buncher a concept at all. Free will is indeed about whether our wills are free or not. You speak of whether we have freedom, over out own choices and decisions. But that's the same thing, whether we have freedom over our will or not, whether our "Will" is "Free" or not.
EvF
