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Atheist Forums › Community › Religion › Christianity v
1984 & A/S/K revisited

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1984 & A/S/K revisited
Godscreated Offline
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#76
RE: 1984 & A/S/K revisited
April 16, 2013 at 12:10 am (This post was last modified: April 16, 2013 at 12:45 am by Godscreated.)
(April 15, 2013 at 8:30 am)ChadWooters Wrote:
(April 15, 2013 at 2:10 am)Godschild Wrote: Your correct, the angels were created into the presence of God and yes later they rejected Him. They do not have a chance at salvation, they are doomed...
Chapter & Verse?

(I ought to talk)

No chapter and verses on their creation, it makes sense that they were created in His presence. Omnipresent comes to mind. I'll have to find the verses that refer to their doom. May take some time.
Doesn't Lucifer's actions against God count in a rebellion as rejection, are they not the same, do not the angels that joined him count?
(April 15, 2013 at 7:27 am)Esquilax Wrote:
(April 15, 2013 at 2:10 am)Godschild Wrote: Your correct, the angels were created into the presence of God and yes later they rejected Him. They do not have a chance at salvation, they are doomed, there's a high price for rejecting God after having knowledge of Him. You need to remember the angels were the originators of sin.

So what's the difference between angels and humans, in this regard? You're literally contradicting yourself: knowledge of god would, to you, breach free will, only it won't in cases like the fallen angels. How do you keep these two competing, mutually exclusive ideas in your head?

The angels were created with free will, that's a given, they rejected their creator. They lived in the presence of God, thus knowing Him from observation. This is how He wanted it apparently. They fell for the same type of lie that Lucifer used on Adam and Eve.
Adam and Eve were created with free will, that's a given, they rejected their creator. They lived in the presence of God, thus knowing Him through observation. This is how He wanted it apparently. They fell for the same type of lie that Lucifer used on the angels. So where is it I have things mixed up. God removed Himself from the presence of man and the angels from His presence, both sinful parties were and are removed from God's presence. Again where have I shown a difference. The angels that are still living with God learned by example messing with the will of God is not a thing to be doing. Man, well we still have not learned much.
God loves those who believe and those who do not and the same goes for me, you have no choice in this matter. That puts the matter of total free will to rest.
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Atheist Forums › Community › Religion › Christianity v
1984 & A/S/K revisited

Messages In This Thread
1984 & A/S/K revisited - by FallentoReason - April 9, 2013 at 12:55 am
RE: 1984 & A/S/K revisited - by Undeceived - April 9, 2013 at 2:09 am
RE: 1984 & A/S/K revisited - by FallentoReason - April 9, 2013 at 2:13 am
RE: 1984 & A/S/K revisited - by Godschild - April 9, 2013 at 3:20 am
RE: 1984 & A/S/K revisited - by FallentoReason - April 9, 2013 at 3:31 am
RE: 1984 & A/S/K revisited - by Godschild - April 9, 2013 at 8:07 pm
RE: 1984 & A/S/K revisited - by Anomalocaris - April 10, 2013 at 1:13 pm
RE: 1984 & A/S/K revisited - by Drich - April 17, 2013 at 11:11 am
RE: 1984 & A/S/K revisited - by Esquilax - April 17, 2013 at 11:47 am
RE: 1984 & A/S/K revisited - by Undeceived - April 9, 2013 at 6:58 pm
RE: 1984 & A/S/K revisited - by FallentoReason - April 9, 2013 at 11:52 pm
RE: 1984 & A/S/K revisited - by Godschild - April 10, 2013 at 12:24 am
RE: 1984 & A/S/K revisited - by FallentoReason - April 10, 2013 at 12:44 am
RE: 1984 & A/S/K revisited - by Undeceived - April 10, 2013 at 1:01 am
RE: 1984 & A/S/K revisited - by FallentoReason - April 10, 2013 at 8:57 am
RE: 1984 & A/S/K revisited - by Undeceived - April 10, 2013 at 1:08 pm
RE: 1984 & A/S/K revisited - by Godschild - April 10, 2013 at 7:53 pm
RE: 1984 & A/S/K revisited - by Ryantology - April 10, 2013 at 9:03 pm
RE: 1984 & A/S/K revisited - by Godschild - April 11, 2013 at 4:01 am
RE: 1984 & A/S/K revisited - by Ryantology - April 11, 2013 at 1:36 pm
RE: 1984 & A/S/K revisited - by FallentoReason - April 11, 2013 at 5:48 am
RE: 1984 & A/S/K revisited - by Godschild - April 12, 2013 at 5:16 am
RE: 1984 & A/S/K revisited - by FallentoReason - April 12, 2013 at 6:16 am
RE: 1984 & A/S/K revisited - by pocaracas - April 12, 2013 at 11:08 am
RE: 1984 & A/S/K revisited - by Godschild - April 14, 2013 at 10:18 pm
RE: 1984 & A/S/K revisited - by FallentoReason - April 14, 2013 at 11:15 pm
RE: 1984 & A/S/K revisited - by Neo-Scholastic - April 14, 2013 at 11:22 pm
RE: 1984 & A/S/K revisited - by FallentoReason - April 15, 2013 at 4:41 am
RE: 1984 & A/S/K revisited - by Godschild - April 15, 2013 at 2:10 am
RE: 1984 & A/S/K revisited - by Esquilax - April 15, 2013 at 7:27 am
RE: 1984 & A/S/K revisited - by FallentoReason - April 15, 2013 at 12:46 pm
RE: 1984 & A/S/K revisited - by Esquilax - April 15, 2013 at 1:58 pm
RE: 1984 & A/S/K revisited - by FallentoReason - April 15, 2013 at 11:48 pm
RE: 1984 & A/S/K revisited - by Neo-Scholastic - April 15, 2013 at 8:30 am
RE: 1984 & A/S/K revisited - by Tonus - April 15, 2013 at 11:19 am
RE: 1984 & A/S/K revisited - by Godschild - April 16, 2013 at 12:10 am
RE: 1984 & A/S/K revisited - by Esquilax - April 16, 2013 at 3:15 am
RE: 1984 & A/S/K revisited - by Godschild - April 16, 2013 at 3:55 am
RE: 1984 & A/S/K revisited - by pocaracas - April 16, 2013 at 5:30 am
RE: 1984 & A/S/K revisited - by Waratah - April 16, 2013 at 7:54 am
RE: 1984 & A/S/K revisited - by Godschild - April 16, 2013 at 10:55 pm
RE: 1984 & A/S/K revisited - by Waratah - April 17, 2013 at 5:41 am
RE: 1984 & A/S/K revisited - by Godschild - April 17, 2013 at 5:20 pm
RE: 1984 & A/S/K revisited - by Ryantology - April 17, 2013 at 6:40 pm
RE: 1984 & A/S/K revisited - by Esquilax - April 18, 2013 at 12:59 am
RE: 1984 & A/S/K revisited - by Waratah - April 18, 2013 at 8:11 pm
RE: 1984 & A/S/K revisited - by Godschild - April 10, 2013 at 1:12 am
RE: 1984 & A/S/K revisited - by Ryantology - April 10, 2013 at 2:39 am
RE: 1984 & A/S/K revisited - by Ryantology - April 9, 2013 at 7:23 pm
RE: 1984 & A/S/K revisited - by Ryantology - April 10, 2013 at 12:38 am
RE: 1984 & A/S/K revisited - by Neo-Scholastic - April 10, 2013 at 12:57 pm
RE: 1984 & A/S/K revisited - by FallentoReason - April 11, 2013 at 4:29 am
RE: 1984 & A/S/K revisited - by Neo-Scholastic - April 11, 2013 at 12:14 pm
RE: 1984 & A/S/K revisited - by FallentoReason - April 12, 2013 at 12:21 am
RE: 1984 & A/S/K revisited - by The Grand Nudger - April 10, 2013 at 7:39 pm
RE: 1984 & A/S/K revisited - by Undeceived - April 11, 2013 at 12:43 pm
RE: 1984 & A/S/K revisited - by Darkstar - April 11, 2013 at 2:41 pm
RE: 1984 & A/S/K revisited - by Undeceived - April 11, 2013 at 6:05 pm
RE: 1984 & A/S/K revisited - by Darkstar - April 11, 2013 at 6:21 pm
RE: 1984 & A/S/K revisited - by Undeceived - April 11, 2013 at 10:12 pm
RE: 1984 & A/S/K revisited - by Darkstar - April 11, 2013 at 10:17 pm
RE: 1984 & A/S/K revisited - by Undeceived - April 12, 2013 at 12:41 pm
RE: 1984 & A/S/K revisited - by downbeatplumb - April 12, 2013 at 12:52 pm
RE: 1984 & A/S/K revisited - by Ryantology - April 12, 2013 at 2:15 pm
RE: 1984 & A/S/K revisited - by Esquilax - April 12, 2013 at 1:14 pm
RE: 1984 & A/S/K revisited - by Undeceived - April 12, 2013 at 1:59 pm
RE: 1984 & A/S/K revisited - by downbeatplumb - April 12, 2013 at 2:42 pm
RE: 1984 & A/S/K revisited - by Undeceived - April 12, 2013 at 5:44 pm
RE: 1984 & A/S/K revisited - by Darkstar - April 12, 2013 at 6:08 pm
RE: 1984 & A/S/K revisited - by Esquilax - April 12, 2013 at 10:57 pm
RE: 1984 & A/S/K revisited - by Undeceived - April 13, 2013 at 3:17 am
RE: 1984 & A/S/K revisited - by Esquilax - April 13, 2013 at 3:57 am
RE: 1984 & A/S/K revisited - by Undeceived - April 13, 2013 at 1:44 pm
RE: 1984 & A/S/K revisited - by Esquilax - April 13, 2013 at 2:26 pm
RE: 1984 & A/S/K revisited - by Undeceived - April 13, 2013 at 4:41 pm
RE: 1984 & A/S/K revisited - by Esquilax - April 14, 2013 at 5:57 am
RE: 1984 & A/S/K revisited - by downbeatplumb - April 14, 2013 at 5:31 am
RE: 1984 & A/S/K revisited - by downbeatplumb - April 13, 2013 at 5:19 am
RE: 1984 & A/S/K revisited - by FallentoReason - April 12, 2013 at 9:02 pm
RE: 1984 & A/S/K revisited - by ebg - April 12, 2013 at 11:34 pm
RE: 1984 & A/S/K revisited - by Tonus - April 13, 2013 at 7:12 am
RE: 1984 & A/S/K revisited - by Neo-Scholastic - April 13, 2013 at 12:12 am
RE: 1984 & A/S/K revisited - by downbeatplumb - April 13, 2013 at 11:35 am
RE: 1984 & A/S/K revisited - by Neo-Scholastic - April 13, 2013 at 4:51 pm
RE: 1984 & A/S/K revisited - by downbeatplumb - April 14, 2013 at 6:15 am
RE: 1984 & A/S/K revisited - by The Grand Nudger - April 14, 2013 at 8:19 am
RE: 1984 & A/S/K revisited - by downbeatplumb - April 14, 2013 at 10:47 am
RE: 1984 & A/S/K revisited - by FallentoReason - April 14, 2013 at 10:52 am
RE: 1984 & A/S/K revisited - by Ryantology - April 17, 2013 at 12:09 am
RE: 1984 & A/S/K revisited - by Godschild - April 17, 2013 at 12:55 am
RE: 1984 & A/S/K revisited - by Ryantology - April 17, 2013 at 1:41 am
RE: 1984 & A/S/K revisited - by Godschild - April 17, 2013 at 4:40 am
RE: 1984 & A/S/K revisited - by Ryantology - April 17, 2013 at 9:07 am
RE: 1984 & A/S/K revisited - by Esquilax - April 17, 2013 at 10:28 am
RE: 1984 & A/S/K revisited - by Ryantology - April 17, 2013 at 10:33 am
RE: 1984 & A/S/K revisited - by pocaracas - April 17, 2013 at 11:18 am
RE: 1984 & A/S/K revisited - by FallentoReason - April 17, 2013 at 11:32 am
RE: 1984 & A/S/K revisited - by pocaracas - April 17, 2013 at 11:39 am
RE: 1984 & A/S/K revisited - by Ryantology - April 17, 2013 at 3:25 pm
RE: 1984 & A/S/K revisited - by pocaracas - April 17, 2013 at 6:01 pm
RE: 1984 & A/S/K revisited - by Godschild - April 18, 2013 at 7:42 am
RE: 1984 & A/S/K revisited - by pocaracas - April 18, 2013 at 9:45 am
RE: 1984 & A/S/K revisited - by Godschild - April 18, 2013 at 6:35 pm
RE: 1984 & A/S/K revisited - by pocaracas - April 18, 2013 at 7:00 pm
RE: 1984 & A/S/K revisited - by Godschild - April 19, 2013 at 12:15 am
RE: 1984 & A/S/K revisited - by pocaracas - April 19, 2013 at 9:09 am
RE: 1984 & A/S/K revisited - by Esquilax - April 19, 2013 at 2:48 am
RE: 1984 & A/S/K revisited - by Esquilax - April 18, 2013 at 2:22 pm
RE: 1984 & A/S/K revisited - by Waratah - April 19, 2013 at 1:12 am
RE: 1984 & A/S/K revisited - by Godschild - April 19, 2013 at 1:29 am
RE: 1984 & A/S/K revisited - by Waratah - April 19, 2013 at 3:27 am
RE: 1984 & A/S/K revisited - by Tonus - April 19, 2013 at 6:43 am
RE: 1984 & A/S/K revisited - by Godschild - April 19, 2013 at 8:43 am
RE: 1984 & A/S/K revisited - by Waratah - April 19, 2013 at 10:24 am
RE: 1984 & A/S/K revisited - by Waratah - April 17, 2013 at 9:14 pm
RE: 1984 & A/S/K revisited - by Ryantology - April 18, 2013 at 8:42 pm
RE: 1984 & A/S/K revisited - by Godschild - April 18, 2013 at 11:14 pm
RE: 1984 & A/S/K revisited - by Ryantology - April 18, 2013 at 11:54 pm
RE: 1984 & A/S/K revisited - by Brayton.l - April 19, 2013 at 12:14 am
RE: 1984 & A/S/K revisited - by downbeatplumb - April 19, 2013 at 11:34 am
RE: 1984 & A/S/K revisited - by Godschild - April 22, 2013 at 2:35 am
RE: 1984 & A/S/K revisited - by pocaracas - April 22, 2013 at 5:03 am
RE: 1984 & A/S/K revisited - by Godschild - April 22, 2013 at 1:03 pm
RE: 1984 & A/S/K revisited - by downbeatplumb - April 22, 2013 at 1:03 pm
RE: 1984 & A/S/K revisited - by Godschild - April 22, 2013 at 3:31 pm
RE: 1984 & A/S/K revisited - by The Grand Nudger - April 22, 2013 at 12:46 pm
RE: 1984 & A/S/K revisited - by Godschild - April 23, 2013 at 3:57 am
RE: 1984 & A/S/K revisited - by Esquilax - April 23, 2013 at 5:26 am
RE: 1984 & A/S/K revisited - by The Grand Nudger - April 23, 2013 at 9:12 am
RE: 1984 & A/S/K revisited - by pocaracas - April 23, 2013 at 9:32 am



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