RE: Proving God Existence
April 20, 2013 at 8:46 am
(This post was last modified: April 20, 2013 at 9:24 am by paulpablo.)
(April 20, 2013 at 6:28 am)Muslim Scholar Wrote:(April 18, 2013 at 10:02 pm)paulpablo Wrote: If you can't explain how god does anything you can't tell me that he can't be a creature and be a god, you can't tell god what he can't do.You are mixing between science and logic
You need to take all of theses examples back to its roots
If the problem is unknown science then it may happen (for example a flying horse or stick into snake, etc.)
But if the problem is a logical contradiction/paradox then it cannot happen (even by God himself) because it is based on your definition of terms
For example turning stick into a snake is unknown
but being a stick and a snake at the same time is impossible (because we defined the terms "Snake" and "Stick" and they are mutually exclusive)
Quote:But I think the root of the problem is that you're using logic to prove the illogical.No, I'm using logic to prove the impossibility of the Illogical.
Quote:So you don't know that he can't effect light either, its a total contradiction.It goes back to our definition of Image (i.e. a light reflection of an object)
As God is not an object then an (according to our definition) image of him is impossible.
Right if light cannot be reflected off him because he is not an object and it impossible then it's also impossible for him to effect anything else which is an object.
Also image may not have anything to do with light, you can have a mental image of something that involves no light, but if you want to use it in terms of our direct senses then the same would apply to hearing, or talking.
He also cannot oscillate air molecules to create a sound and therefore cannot talk to people either, or communicate in any other way.
Quote: and Allah will be sufficient for you against them. And He is the Hearing, the Knowing.
You talk about our definition of an image. Light being reflected off an object. Which as I've mentioned doesn't account for the fact you can have a mental image of something that involves no light but as I've said if you want to talk about direct senses then think about this.
The quran says allah is all hearing, according to our definition of hearing that is impossible if he cannot reflect light he also would not be able to detect the oscillation of air molecules against his ear drums or any part of his body, because he doesn't have a body.
Using your own logic I've just proven god doesn't exist.
But anyway just let me get your argument straight.
God cannot reflect light that would be impossible.
God can make a virgin pregnant it isn't impossible we just don't know how yet.
God cannot have a son that would be impossible.
god can turn a stick into a snake, create floods and make a horse fly we just don't know how yet.
Well my counter argument is god can have a son and reflect light, you just don't understand how. I don't believe that by the way, but according to your logic it's a good argument. I could just say god provides you with a mental image, and he can be in two places at once and be two things at the same time. According to you he does this anyway because he is outside of space and time and immaterial yet he comes to earth to cause floods, meaning he interacts with things in this world while at the same time as being outside of the universe, so why can't he live on earth as a creature?
Can you not see how you are allowing for what is written in the quran by saying it may happen (virgins becoming pregnant, god hearing things, people hearing god, god making floods)
but for anything going against your religion you are simply saying it isn't permissible (god reflecting light, god having a son)
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