Are we the same or different?

[theVOID]

Excluding identity from space-time was just a mental excercise to help me better understand a concept.

I feel consciousness is a constuct of ideals and values

That would posit that ideals and values are possible without consciousness, which i totally disagree with.

is subjective and as a concept is immaterial

Yes in it's self it is immaterial, but it also has a basis in the physical circuitry of the brain, much the same way an operating system is immaterial yet entirely dependent on physical circuitry.

It may be created by the material brain, but the brain is just the machine that produces them.
It obviously exists and is a universal concept, thus we can call it real, but I still wouldn't call it tangible.

This to me seems to demean the role of the brain in consciousness, it not only creates it but it sustains it and is absolutely essential for it's survival.

My point is trying to define , consciousness, holy spirit and concepts like God and irrational numbers. Christians view the holy spirit as something everyone has access to if it's accepted, therefore a universal existance of intangible concept, thus real.

Insisting that this spirit is real and that everyone has access to it does not make it so, can you demonstrate the spirit in any way? Without definition and demonstration you have achieved nothing.

Also note that the idea or concept of something can exist regardless of whether or not the thing that it points to exists or not, so you can easily say that the concept of the spirit exists, but you cannot demonstrate the spirit to which the concept points.

God is external from the self and thusly unprovable, but through the holy spirit can be "known" and better defined and seem more real and less intangible. Opinions?

So it seems real to you... So what? The earth seemed flat once, didn't make it so.