RE: Pleasure and Joy
August 31, 2013 at 7:18 am
(This post was last modified: August 31, 2013 at 7:28 am by Harris.)
(August 28, 2013 at 4:27 am)paulpablo Wrote: Also I'd just like to add that it isn't the duty of every atheist to go disproving every crazy prophet in the world out there, to disprove every religion we would have to learn languages that don't exist, or languages that we don't know, plus there wouldn't be enough time in one life time to read every religious scripture in the world, or listen to every single claim.
I haven't read the quran in arabic, according to some muslims that's the only way to understand it.
I don't see it as my duty to learn a language just so I can be sure for 100 percent that a horse didn't fly and that a stick didn't turn into a snake, and that evolution didn't happen instead someone said "be" to some dust to create a man.
If you are an adamant person then even learning Arabic will not help you. Translation of Quran is sufficient to have the basic idea on what Quran is commanding. It’s only a matter of reading it with a neutral mind.
(August 28, 2013 at 5:29 am)BrianSoddingBoru4 Wrote: Brain function IS consciousness. The notion of consciousness surviving the wreck of the brain is analagous to 150 kph surviving the wreck of the car.
Boru
If you say brain function IS consciousness then why brain is functioning at all? In other words, what is keeping brain to function? You know better than I do that behind every effect there is a cause. Car needs a driver in order to perform its functions. Behind the functioning of car the cause is the driver’s intensions.
(August 28, 2013 at 8:54 pm)Ryantology Wrote: Prove that the Quran is making a true claim about the existence and properties of a god.
Note: the Quran could be scientifically, mathematically, and historically accurate down to the letter, but that does nothing to verify its most basic and fundamental claim; the only claim that really matters.
The claims of your religion are unfalsifiable and unproven and, therefore, worthless.
Today scientists and philosophers, whether they belong to theist or atheist schools of thoughts, agrees that within or outside the universe there is nothing so called “Nothingness”. Almost everyone now agrees that there is nothing in the universe, which comes out of “Nothingness” as “Nothingness” simply doesn’t exist. Now if there is “No Nothingness” then from where the roots of this universe grew? Why there is a balance in the universe, why not a chaos? Things like Chance has least value scientifically, logically, rationally, and empirically in all aspects of human understanding. CHANCE sparkles mostly in the vicinity of human desires.
Theist uses the word God and simplifies his task to explain this “No Nothingness”. However, atheist finds it hard to give explanation to this “No Nothingness” and come up with different theories and models. Like multiverse model, inflationary model, string theory, etc. but all these hypotheses are highly speculative scientifically. Before atheist argued that universe exists from eternity, will exist up to eternity but scientific facts force him to accept that universe was not eternal, and will not be eternal. Now atheist doesn’t argue against the origin of universe but in parallel he has no logical explanation on what caused this universe if there is no Super Intelligent Being, “God”.
Another thing, which astounds all scientists and philosophers, are the subjects of Grand Design and Supernatural Balance in the universe. Universe is a place of order, balance, and symmetry. Think of the earth if it moves only 1 cm towards or away from the sun, this short deviation from its path becomes a threat to life on earth. Look at the human body how accurate and perfectly balanced functions are happening within it without our own incentives. Simply look at the function of genes and that alone gives you surprises after surprises.
By words, one can deny the existence of God but no one can explain how this grand design and fine-tuning is running on its own. It is a laughable joke for us if someone says his wristwatch caused by some desert as a matter of chance and it is running precisely by its own without the need of an operator. However, we don’t laugh when we say this humongous and intricate universe caused by itself as a matter of chance and it is running super precisely by its own.
Verily! In the creation of the heavens and the earth, and in the alternation of night and day, and the ships which sail through the sea with that which is of use to mankind, and the water which Allah sends down from the sky and makes the earth alive therewith after its death, and the moving (living) creatures of all kinds that He has scattered therein, and in the veering of winds and clouds which are held between the sky and the earth, are indeed Ayat (proofs, evidences, signs, etc.) for people of understanding.
Al Baqarah (2)
-Verse 164-
Al Quran
Try to tackle with the following arguments:
First Argument
(1) Whatever begins to exist is caused to exist by something else.
(2) The universe began to exist.
(3) Therefore the universe was caused to exist; and the cause of its existence is God.
Al-Ghazali, Abu Hamid (1058-1111)
Second Argument
We recognize that we ourselves are not made by ourselves but by something else; however, we as rational beings are certainly superior to the world of non-rational things. This would not be so if that world were something that caused itself, because anything which relies only on itself for its subsistence is superior to anything that relies on something other than itself. Hence that world is brought into existence by something else, a maker or ruler, and this we call God.
Abelard, Peter (1079-1142)