Pleasure and Joy

[Harris]

Human genes developing into ape genes makes no sense.
It's the same as saying biologists disagree that felines can be developed into cats, cats are felines.
Biologists classify humans as apes, great apes (hominidae) The family also includes chimpanzees and gorillas. Human genes are the genes of apes.

First and foremost Darwin’s Theory of evolution is a THEORY and not an established scientific fact. From history of science, we know that hypothesis and theories may take U-Turns. So far, I never encountered something like FACTS OF EVOLUTION in any book I have read.

In 1861 Charles Darwin wrote a letter to his friend Thomas Thomson saying, “I don’t believe in the word natural selection (theory of evolution) because I don’t have any proof. I only believe in it because it helps me in classification of Embryology, in morphology, in rudimentary organs”.

Basically, the idea of evolution was supported by the opponents of church who were against bible. That support to Darwin’s Theory of evolution was purely based on politics not because theory was true. “Enemy of my enemy is friend of mine”.

Science tells us there were four hominoids.

a. Lucy
The nickname of a partial female skeleton of a fossil hominid found in Ethiopia in 1974, about 3.2 million years old and 1.2 m (4 ft) in height

b. Homo sapiens
Modern humans belong to these primate species. They live about 500,000 years ago.

c. Neanderthal man
An extinct species of human that was widely distributed in ice age Europe between c. 120,000 and 35,000 years ago, with a receding forehead and prominent brow ridges. The Neanderthals were associated with the Mousterian flint industry of the Middle Palaeolithic People lived in Europe between 35,000 and 70,000 years ago.

d. Cro-Magnon man
The earliest form of modern human in Europe, associated with the Aurignacian flint industry. The group's appearance c. 35,000 years ago marked the beginning of the Upper Palaeolithic and the apparent decline and disappearance of Neanderthal man; the group persisted at least into the Neolithic period

Most interestingly there are no links between these four humanlike species. It is an absurd to derive roots of present day humans out from the fossils.

Secondly, according to molecular biology theory (the genetic coding), visualization of single ape DNA evolving into Human DNA is almost infinitesimally improbable.

Web is full of such controversies.

The web is full of controversies that giants exist, this point is irrelevant.

If this point is irrelevant then why you are giving references from the web?

Cartoons of Prophet Mohammad were intended to humiliate Islam based on hatred and Jealousy. There was no literary contention behind that act.

This is another irrelevant point.

In this act, no logical reasoning was involved. It was thoroughly aimed to humiliate Muslims all around the World.

They are well aware about their audiences in Muslim world who are around 2 billion in numbers.

This is a relevant point which supports my argument, why would the BBC one of the most politically correct tv stations look at the political climate, muslims murdering cartoonists, book publishers and other people in the media then come to the conclusion that they should commission a program which intentionally tries to debunk the quran. Also being aware of how many muslims are in the audience?

BBC and CNN are politically most hypocrite channels in the world. When Soviets were killing poor Afghans, both these channels were showing great sympathy to Afghan nation. However, when Allied forces entered Afghanistan, both these channels had transformed whole Afghan population into Terrorist to justify killings of poor women, children, and elderly citizens. Policies of these channels are based on double standards.

Again people have challenged this but no one seems to know what the quran actually says and the people who do disagree on what it says.

If you say there is no God then this is not a challenge for Quran because Quran has given logical and rational clues for the existence of God.

If you say that people have challenged Quran by producing a book similar or better than Quran then I don’t know any official record of such a book.

The only critique (not challenge) which people tried against Quran is a claim that Quran has discrepancies and errors. Nevertheless, all false allegations had long been refuted with success and consequently no challenger is giving references to those concocted allegation in his scholarly work anymore.

No there are many ambiguous statements in the quran that are ambiguous because of the definition of the words they use.

Here is one example.

And of everything We have created pairs, that you may remember (the Grace of Allah).

This verse is from

Adz-Dzaariya (51)
-Verse 49-

Let me comment on the meanings:

(And of everything We have created pairs,) meaning, all the created are in pairs, the heaven and earth, night and day, sun and moon, land and sea, light and darkness, faith and disbelief, death and life, misery and happiness, Paradise and Fire, in addition to the animals and plants. The statement of Allah the Exalted,

(that you may remember) and know that the Creator, Allah, is One without partners,

We only know that the concept of pairs exist in living beings (human, animals, plants) and we can apply notion of pair on concepts like positive & negative. However, we have not reached to the level of knowledge where we could apprehend the meaning of pairs in its totality.

I have used the pair samples in my commentary just for an objective purpose. Those might not be appropriate scientifically.

We are not certain on what does the phrase “everything are in pairs” means. This shows our incompetence due to insufficient acquired knowledge and this human hesitation, Quran has highlighted at a different place:

Glory to Allah, Who created in pairs all things that the earth produces, as well as their own (human) kind AND (OTHER) THINGS OF WHICH THEY HAVE NO KNOWLEDGE.
Yaa Siin (36)
-Verse 36-

[quote='paulpablo' pid='501063' dateline='1377985289']
I've heard muslims say this verse is talking about electrons, and talking about pairs of sexual mates which they insist do all come in pairs.

This verse is giving no information. If I worked as a top scientist and one day I came into work and said to my colleges who were other respectable scientists. "Everything is created in pairs so that we be mindful" it wouldn't be a breakthrough, it's not a revelation. No one can prove it wrong or right or do any testable experiments on it because it isn't specific enough information.

It’s an important point you raised here.

“No one can prove it wrong or right or do any testable experiments on it because it isn't specific enough information.”

This is very true.

Several times, I mentioned that Quran is not a book of science, history, etc. The basic purpose of Quran is to unite people based on moral values. This purpose cannot be achieved without firm faith in Allah who is the supreme ruler and creator of everything.

(Here will not go in details why God is central in keeping people on their moral values. That is an entirely different topic).

As a token, Quran provides some technical information in from of clues so to keep its authentication firm on its claim to be the word of God. It is not the intention of Quran to reveal intricate scientific details at all.

These clues are helpful to facilitate development of faith in modern minds. Based on established scientific facts, which are in perfect conformity with known clues of Quran, modern thinker has clear evidences that other than God no man could have given those clues in time when intellect of man was not proficient for originating such scientifically correct hints.

In 2002, Moore declined to be interviewed by the Wall Street Journal on the subject of his work on Islam, stating that "it's been ten or eleven years since I was involved in the Qur'an."

I assume he's actually embarrased about the work he did with the quran. Even in the interviews I've seen he did not say he converted to Islam. I could be wrong though.

I don’t know either about his latest work on Embryology and about his approach towards Islam.

Again this is a perfect example of a verse which is ambiguous, when PZ myers was interviewed by muslims who told him the quran says specifically the bones come first then the flesh he said it was incorrect because the bones and the flesh form simultaneously, to which the muslims responded by saying the words in the quran could also be taken to mean the bones and the flesh form simultaneously.

So again if muslims haven't agreed even in their own minds as to what the quran means then it can't be proven right or wrong, you need to first know what a book actually says before it can be proven right or wrong.

Unfortunately, I haven’t seen that interview but if what you are saying is true then from that I can postulate that the host had lack of proper knowledge.

The guest (PZ Myers) was at the same time correct as well as wrong in stating that “bones and the flesh form simultaneously”. It seems he had not commented on the technical side of this simultaneously formation.

Quran states:

Man We did create from a quintessence (of clay);
Then We placed him as (a drop of) sperm in a place of rest, firmly fixed;
Then We made the sperm into a clot of congealed (leech like) blood;
Then of that clot We made a (chewed like) lump;
Then we made out of that lump bones and clothed the bones with flesh;
Then we developed out of it another creature. So blessed be Allah, the best to create!

Al Mu'minuun (23)
-Verses 12 to 14-

In the above verses, Quran is precise in stating first come the bones then flesh.

So question arises whether Quranic statement is wrong or is it science making some mistake? If I say neither science nor Quran is wrong this might make you confuse in first instance but in fact, this is the reality.

First point to be noted that description of embryological stages in Quran is based upon appearances not on the functions.

First appearance, leech like substance that clings and looks like blood clot
Second appearance is chewed like lump
Third appearance of bones and flesh

Regarding bones and flesh, embryology says that primordia of the muscles and the bones form together between the 25th and 48 days, which is the stage Quran refer to as Mudgha (chewed like lump) but both bones and muscles, are not developed yet. At the end of 7th week, the embryo takes form of human appearance that is the time when the bones are formed. According to modern embryology, bones start to develop after the 42nd day. Moreover, at the end of 7th week it took skeletal appearance. Even at this stage when bones are formed, muscles are yet not developed. After the 7th week and starting of 8th week muscles are formed.

Therefore, primordia of the muscles and the bones are formed simultaneously between the 25th and 48 days but out of the primordia first develop the bones then the muscles. Hence, Quran is perfect in describing the order of all these embryonic stages.

So what? You have just done exactly what I said is illogical about the way muslims look at verses of the quran.
You have took a verse which is saying god will be able to put every part of a mans body back together including the finger tips.
It is totally illogical and conjecture to think this is talking about unique fingerprints.
No where in the verse does it mention finger prints being unique.
If finger prints weren't identical it wouldn't make the verse false therefore the verse is not actually providing information that can be proved true or false.
I genuinely hope you will at least try to understand the point I'm trying to get across to you here.
I'm not saying it's definitely all bullshit, I'm saying from what I've seen it isn't valid information that can be proved true or false to any serious degree at all.

I had given a response on a similar question to what you have imposed here. As an extension to that, I add one more example.

Those who reject our Signs, We shall soon cast into the Fire: as often as their skins are roasted through, We shall change them for fresh skins, that they may taste the penalty: for Allah is Exalted in Power, Wise.
An Nisaa (4)
-Verse 56-

In this verse, Quran had given a clue about our Skins. It is showing our skin has some especial feature. Today we know that it is our skin, which is responsible for the sensation of pain and pleasure due to the presence of pain receptors in it.

When person gets a burn, doctors assess the depth of burn by examining the damage to the pain receptors. At the test if victim does not feel pain, that shows hopelessness for his survival.

No one had any idea to what this clue is pointing before science had revealed characteristics of our skins. However, for a person at any intellectual level and in any time there is no trouble to grasp the formal meaning of this verse.