Our server costs ~$56 per month to run. Please consider donating or becoming a Patron to help keep the site running. Help us gain new members by following us on Twitter and liking our page on Facebook!
Current time: June 13, 2024, 11:38 am

Thread Rating:
  • 0 Vote(s) - 0 Average
  • 1
  • 2
  • 3
  • 4
  • 5
Terrible Atheist Argument #1
RE: Terrible Atheist Argument #1
No, I didn't come up with this. I remember first coming across it by the uploader of those 2 YouTube videos I posted, and in a blog post by a graduate philosophy student on it
(http://www.uncrediblehallq.net/2011/12/1...fway-good/). I later went through Plantinga's original paper on his MOA and he seemed to conclude with what the aforementioned people did: The his argument alone cannot establish it's conclusion:

Plantinga Wrote:But obviously this isn't a proof; no one who didn't already accept the conclusion, would accept the first premise. The ontological argument we've been examining isn't just like this one, of course, but it must be conceded that not everyone who understands and reflects on its central premise -- that the existence of a maximally great being is possible -- will accept it. Still, it is evident, I think, that there is nothing contrary to reason or irrational in accepting this premise. What I claim for this argument, therefore, is that it establishes, not the truth of theism, but its rational acceptability. And hence it accomplishes at least one of the aims of the tradition of natural theology.

I disagree, but his paper seems to contain a few instances where he references this problem of it only working if you can establish the first premise outside of this argument.
"The reason things will never get better is because people keep electing these rich cocksuckers who don't give a shit about you."
-George Carlin
Reply



Messages In This Thread
Terrible Atheist Argument #1 - by Vincenzo Vinny G. - November 6, 2013 at 10:42 pm
RE: Terrible Atheist Argument #1 - by Minimalist - November 6, 2013 at 11:08 pm
RE: Terrible Atheist Argument #1 - by Sejanus - November 6, 2013 at 11:26 pm
RE: Terrible Atheist Argument #1 - by Brakeman - November 6, 2013 at 11:33 pm
RE: Terrible Atheist Argument #1 - by Vincenzo Vinny G. - November 12, 2013 at 10:18 pm
RE: Terrible Atheist Argument #1 - by Esquilax - November 12, 2013 at 10:50 pm
RE: Terrible Atheist Argument #1 - by Ryantology - November 13, 2013 at 3:02 pm
RE: Terrible Atheist Argument #1 - by Bob Kelso - November 6, 2013 at 11:37 pm
RE: Terrible Atheist Argument #1 - by Ryantology - November 7, 2013 at 1:09 am
RE: Terrible Atheist Argument #1 - by max-greece - November 7, 2013 at 2:15 am
RE: Terrible Atheist Argument #1 - by Esquilax - November 7, 2013 at 5:13 am
RE: Terrible Atheist Argument #1 - by pocaracas - November 7, 2013 at 6:51 am
RE: Terrible Atheist Argument #1 - by BrianSoddingBoru4 - November 7, 2013 at 10:35 am
RE: Terrible Atheist Argument #1 - by Minimalist - November 7, 2013 at 4:23 pm
RE: Terrible Atheist Argument #1 - by WesOlsen - November 7, 2013 at 3:02 pm
RE: Terrible Atheist Argument #1 - by catfish - November 7, 2013 at 3:16 pm
RE: Terrible Atheist Argument #1 - by downbeatplumb - November 7, 2013 at 3:20 pm
RE: Terrible Atheist Argument #1 - by catfish - November 7, 2013 at 3:22 pm
RE: Terrible Atheist Argument #1 - by Ayen - November 7, 2013 at 3:43 pm
RE: Terrible Atheist Argument #1 - by MindForgedManacle - November 7, 2013 at 3:07 pm
RE: Terrible Atheist Argument #1 - by Angrboda - November 9, 2013 at 3:08 am
RE: Terrible Atheist Argument #1 - by Esquilax - November 9, 2013 at 3:13 am
RE: Terrible Atheist Argument #1 - by Ayen - November 9, 2013 at 4:07 am
RE: Terrible Atheist Argument #1 - by Lemonvariable72 - November 18, 2013 at 3:04 pm
RE: Terrible Atheist Argument #1 - by WesOlsen - November 7, 2013 at 3:36 pm
RE: Terrible Atheist Argument #1 - by catfish - November 7, 2013 at 3:47 pm
RE: Terrible Atheist Argument #1 - by Jackalope - November 7, 2013 at 3:52 pm
RE: Terrible Atheist Argument #1 - by Optimistic Mysanthrope - November 7, 2013 at 3:45 pm
RE: Terrible Atheist Argument #1 - by WesOlsen - November 7, 2013 at 3:58 pm
RE: Terrible Atheist Argument #1 - by catfish - November 7, 2013 at 4:14 pm
RE: Terrible Atheist Argument #1 - by Doubting Thomas - November 7, 2013 at 3:59 pm
RE: Terrible Atheist Argument #1 - by Faith No More - November 7, 2013 at 4:24 pm
RE: Terrible Atheist Argument #1 - by Simon Moon - November 7, 2013 at 4:33 pm
RE: Terrible Atheist Argument #1 - by Whateverist - November 7, 2013 at 7:07 pm
RE: Terrible Atheist Argument #1 - by pocaracas - November 7, 2013 at 7:43 pm
RE: Terrible Atheist Argument #1 - by Jackalope - November 7, 2013 at 7:45 pm
RE: Terrible Atheist Argument #1 - by paulpablo - November 7, 2013 at 9:31 pm
RE: Terrible Atheist Argument #1 - by genkaus - November 8, 2013 at 4:18 am
RE: Terrible Atheist Argument #1 - by MindForgedManacle - November 12, 2013 at 10:33 pm
RE: Terrible Atheist Argument #1 - by Vincenzo Vinny G. - November 13, 2013 at 5:35 am
RE: Terrible Atheist Argument #1 - by Esquilax - November 13, 2013 at 6:02 am
RE: Terrible Atheist Argument #1 - by pocaracas - November 13, 2013 at 9:46 am
RE: Terrible Atheist Argument #1 - by MindForgedManacle - November 19, 2013 at 1:55 am
RE: Terrible Atheist Argument #1 - by Vincenzo Vinny G. - November 20, 2013 at 4:31 pm
RE: Terrible Atheist Argument #1 - by Zen Badger - November 13, 2013 at 5:55 am
RE: Terrible Atheist Argument #1 - by Vincenzo Vinny G. - November 19, 2013 at 1:20 am
RE: Terrible Atheist Argument #1 - by Esquilax - November 19, 2013 at 2:47 am
RE: Terrible Atheist Argument #1 - by KichigaiNeko - November 13, 2013 at 5:56 am
RE: Terrible Atheist Argument #1 - by Mister Agenda - November 13, 2013 at 5:25 pm
RE: Terrible Atheist Argument #1 - by CapnAwesome - November 14, 2013 at 12:43 pm
RE: Terrible Atheist Argument #1 - by MindForgedManacle - November 20, 2013 at 7:44 pm
RE: Terrible Atheist Argument #1 - by Vincenzo Vinny G. - November 20, 2013 at 8:41 pm
RE: Terrible Atheist Argument #1 - by MindForgedManacle - November 20, 2013 at 10:19 pm
RE: Terrible Atheist Argument #1 - by Vincenzo Vinny G. - November 22, 2013 at 2:07 am
RE: Terrible Atheist Argument #1 - by MindForgedManacle - November 22, 2013 at 10:53 am
RE: Terrible Atheist Argument #1 - by Vincenzo Vinny G. - November 22, 2013 at 10:09 pm
RE: Terrible Atheist Argument #1 - by MindForgedManacle - November 22, 2013 at 11:02 pm
RE: Terrible Atheist Argument #1 - by Vincenzo Vinny G. - November 29, 2013 at 3:19 am
RE: Terrible Atheist Argument #1 - by Statler Waldorf - November 20, 2013 at 9:11 pm
RE: Terrible Atheist Argument #1 - by MitchBenn - November 20, 2013 at 9:35 pm
RE: Terrible Atheist Argument #1 - by Statler Waldorf - November 21, 2013 at 5:51 pm
RE: Terrible Atheist Argument #1 - by Whateverist - November 21, 2013 at 6:36 pm
RE: Terrible Atheist Argument #1 - by MindForgedManacle - November 21, 2013 at 3:27 pm
RE: Terrible Atheist Argument #1 - by MindForgedManacle - November 21, 2013 at 6:46 pm
RE: Terrible Atheist Argument #1 - by Statler Waldorf - November 22, 2013 at 7:13 pm
RE: Terrible Atheist Argument #1 - by Whateverist - November 24, 2013 at 8:32 am
RE: Terrible Atheist Argument #1 - by MindForgedManacle - November 22, 2013 at 6:06 pm
RE: Terrible Atheist Argument #1 - by MindForgedManacle - November 22, 2013 at 7:45 pm
RE: Terrible Atheist Argument #1 - by Statler Waldorf - November 22, 2013 at 8:05 pm
RE: Terrible Atheist Argument #1 - by MindForgedManacle - November 24, 2013 at 12:20 am
RE: Terrible Atheist Argument #1 - by repentsinners - November 24, 2013 at 11:49 am
RE: Terrible Atheist Argument #1 - by downbeatplumb - November 24, 2013 at 1:26 pm
RE: Terrible Atheist Argument #1 - by pocaracas - November 24, 2013 at 2:09 pm
RE: Terrible Atheist Argument #1 - by Lemonvariable72 - November 24, 2013 at 4:20 pm
RE: Terrible Atheist Argument #1 - by pocaracas - November 24, 2013 at 4:36 pm
RE: Terrible Atheist Argument #1 - by Yahweh - November 24, 2013 at 3:19 pm
RE: Terrible Atheist Argument #1 - by MindForgedManacle - November 24, 2013 at 3:28 pm
RE: Terrible Atheist Argument #1 - by Yahweh - November 24, 2013 at 3:37 pm
RE: Terrible Atheist Argument #1 - by Statler Waldorf - November 26, 2013 at 3:11 pm
RE: Terrible Atheist Argument #1 - by Mister Agenda - November 26, 2013 at 4:27 pm
RE: Terrible Atheist Argument #1 - by Statler Waldorf - November 26, 2013 at 5:31 pm
RE: Terrible Atheist Argument #1 - by MindForgedManacle - November 26, 2013 at 9:28 pm
RE: Terrible Atheist Argument #1 - by WesOlsen - November 27, 2013 at 8:10 am
RE: Terrible Atheist Argument #1 - by WesOlsen - November 27, 2013 at 10:45 am
RE: Terrible Atheist Argument #1 - by WesOlsen - November 29, 2013 at 4:15 am
RE: Terrible Atheist Argument #1 - by Vincenzo Vinny G. - November 29, 2013 at 4:43 am
RE: Terrible Atheist Argument #1 - by houseofcantor - November 29, 2013 at 5:55 am
RE: Terrible Atheist Argument #1 - by WesOlsen - November 29, 2013 at 7:11 am
RE: Terrible Atheist Argument #1 - by MindForgedManacle - November 29, 2013 at 10:49 am
RE: Terrible Atheist Argument #1 - by Vincenzo Vinny G. - November 29, 2013 at 5:58 pm
RE: Terrible Atheist Argument #1 - by MindForgedManacle - November 29, 2013 at 9:55 pm
RE: Terrible Atheist Argument #1 - by Vincenzo Vinny G. - December 3, 2013 at 12:26 am
RE: Terrible Atheist Argument #1 - by MindForgedManacle - December 3, 2013 at 12:54 am
RE: Terrible Atheist Argument #1 - by Vincenzo Vinny G. - December 3, 2013 at 1:04 am
RE: Terrible Atheist Argument #1 - by MindForgedManacle - December 3, 2013 at 1:44 am
RE: Terrible Atheist Argument #1 - by Vincenzo Vinny G. - December 3, 2013 at 3:03 am
RE: Terrible Atheist Argument #1 - by MindForgedManacle - December 3, 2013 at 3:34 am
RE: Terrible Atheist Argument #1 - by Vincenzo Vinny G. - December 3, 2013 at 4:04 pm
RE: Terrible Atheist Argument #1 - by MindForgedManacle - December 3, 2013 at 8:37 pm
RE: Terrible Atheist Argument #1 - by Vincenzo Vinny G. - December 4, 2013 at 9:51 pm
RE: Terrible Atheist Argument #1 - by MindForgedManacle - December 5, 2013 at 10:40 am
RE: Terrible Atheist Argument #1 - by Vincenzo Vinny G. - December 5, 2013 at 3:58 pm
RE: Terrible Atheist Argument #1 - by MindForgedManacle - December 5, 2013 at 5:08 pm
RE: Terrible Atheist Argument #1 - by Vincenzo Vinny G. - December 5, 2013 at 11:50 pm
RE: Terrible Atheist Argument #1 - by MindForgedManacle - December 7, 2013 at 6:20 pm

Possibly Related Threads...
Thread Author Replies Views Last Post
  God is a terrible explanation for anything. theVOID 18 4487 November 10, 2010 at 3:14 am
Last Post: God



Users browsing this thread: 1 Guest(s)