RE: Any Vegetarians/Vegans here?
January 20, 2014 at 12:18 pm
(This post was last modified: January 20, 2014 at 12:44 pm by James2014.)
While most people would consider cooking or even pastuerising as "processing" I really don't want to get bogged down in definitions. So why do you consider obtaining B12 from bacteria bad? It is chemically identical to that in meat, it is even used to treat pernicious anaemia (which even meat eaters can get).
Being vegan is healthy, reduces the risk of acquiring a number of diseases and increases life expectancy. Eating meat on the other had is merely cruel.
Everything I write here, unless in quotation marks, is written by me. However you are right, that some of what I write may also be found on other websites. How would you solve this logical puzzle?
Firstly, any form of killing that prevents an animal from living its full life span is inducing a form of suffering.
Secondly, I would argue that life on a farm is far worse. At least in the wild I have a rich and complex environment to explore. On a farm it its monotonous, with every single young animal forcibly removed from its mother. Overfed and over weight, in a dense population were disease is easily spread. Udder infections branding, dehorning, clipping of the chickens beak. Its a horrible life. At least as a wild animals I have a chance.
Thirdly, ethical concerns comprise of the effects of actions of ethical beings. Animals are amoral, so the effects of their relations are similarly not of ethical concern. Your actions have are and eating meat is cruel and wrong.
Lastly, you say that your obsession with meat is not an obsession because it is natural and normal. Sounds like two fallacies in one sentence. Appeal to the people, and to nature.
Hi Enrico,
Mozzarella has B12, as do all cheeses/milk. If you were to stop eating cheese then supplemented food (a lot of food is supplemented with B12 these days, pretty much all breakfast cereals and soya/nut milks) or supplements would be required. Of course the effects wouldn't visible strait away, we have about 5 years worth of B12 stored in our bodies.
How do animals get it? Herbivores have bacteria in their intestines that produce it. We don't have these bacteria. Some people argue that B12 can also be found on unwashed vegetables, its not proven though. The ultimate test would be to give someone who has pernicious anaemia (sever B12 deficiency) some unwashed veg, and see if they get better. That would probably be quite unethical though, so the experiment has never been done (afaik)
Being vegan is healthy, reduces the risk of acquiring a number of diseases and increases life expectancy. Eating meat on the other had is merely cruel.
(January 19, 2014 at 5:42 pm)Bad Wolf Wrote: And btw, I saw you have copied and pasted your paragraph about cows and bulls from some website or other. It doesn't lend credibility to your argument when you didn't write it yourself.
Everything I write here, unless in quotation marks, is written by me. However you are right, that some of what I write may also be found on other websites. How would you solve this logical puzzle?
(January 19, 2014 at 5:42 pm)Bad Wolf Wrote: Your whole argument seems to be that animals suffer, so we shouldn't eat them. Well, if animals didn't suffer would it be ok to eat them?
And besides, animals we eat have a better life than they would in the wild. No predators to worry about, a consistant supply of food, a safe place to sleep at night. And at the end, a relatively painless death. Euthanasia. Even we aren't allowed to do that to humans who are suffering. Most of the time, these animals actually get an easier death than humans. I would much rather be killed like a cow than lying in a hospital bed struggling to breath from old age. Or wasting away from cancer and some other disease.
Obsession with eating meat? No it doesn't work like that. Eating meat, is completely normal and natural. It is in fact you that has the obsession.
Firstly, any form of killing that prevents an animal from living its full life span is inducing a form of suffering.
Secondly, I would argue that life on a farm is far worse. At least in the wild I have a rich and complex environment to explore. On a farm it its monotonous, with every single young animal forcibly removed from its mother. Overfed and over weight, in a dense population were disease is easily spread. Udder infections branding, dehorning, clipping of the chickens beak. Its a horrible life. At least as a wild animals I have a chance.
Thirdly, ethical concerns comprise of the effects of actions of ethical beings. Animals are amoral, so the effects of their relations are similarly not of ethical concern. Your actions have are and eating meat is cruel and wrong.
Lastly, you say that your obsession with meat is not an obsession because it is natural and normal. Sounds like two fallacies in one sentence. Appeal to the people, and to nature.
(January 20, 2014 at 10:35 am)enrico Wrote: Question 1
I am vegetarian (almost vegan if wouldn't be for the mozzarella on the pizza) and i don't take B12 supplement.
I am still alive and well.
How is possible considering that somebody said that without B12 you can't make it?
Question 2
Herbivores do not eat meat (obviously) so how come that their flesh is full of B12?
Hi Enrico,
Mozzarella has B12, as do all cheeses/milk. If you were to stop eating cheese then supplemented food (a lot of food is supplemented with B12 these days, pretty much all breakfast cereals and soya/nut milks) or supplements would be required. Of course the effects wouldn't visible strait away, we have about 5 years worth of B12 stored in our bodies.
How do animals get it? Herbivores have bacteria in their intestines that produce it. We don't have these bacteria. Some people argue that B12 can also be found on unwashed vegetables, its not proven though. The ultimate test would be to give someone who has pernicious anaemia (sever B12 deficiency) some unwashed veg, and see if they get better. That would probably be quite unethical though, so the experiment has never been done (afaik)
