Hi from Logikos

[Logikos]

What I am saying is, it has done more bad than good.

I am antitheism because theism has caused many tragedies in the past few centuries.

Hitler was a Catholic and he caused the death of millions, Catholic priests have raped innumerable children, Muslim suicide bombers and fanatics have caused the death of countless innocent people, the Serbian war was a religious one, the conflict in Ireland is also religious, and then there was the many Crusades.

Also religion has halted the advancement of knowledge, it spreads intolerance and bigotry, it changes otherwise healthy minded people into crazy shells of humans driven to do unjust actions like starving their own child because their religion has told them it will lead the kid to be healed.

I've no idea how you make the judgement that it has done more bad than good, but I'll leave that to one side.

You have given examples of theists who have caused harm. I might have some issues with the details, but that is a tangent not worth bothering with. The point is, is it the nature of theistic belief that causes theists to cause harm, or is it the nature of the person. As you already admit, plenty of theists do not cause harm - proving that the harm that some theists have caused is not necessarily due to their theistic beliefs. So again you are not antitheist but anti-detrimental-theist. I am exactly the same - in fact I am anti-detrimental-anyone.

Again, some religious beliefs halt the advance of science, but not theism in general. In fact I would argue that the pursuit of science actually makes more sense within a theistic belief system than an atheistic one.

Does theism lead to intolerance and bigotry and starving children? Again, it depends on which theists we're talking about.

The simple fact is that the nature of theistic belief does not cause harm. This is obvious when we see that theism is perfectly compatible (in fact I would argue there is even an implication to) the belief that the world and the people in it are of value and should not be harmed. Theism does not cause harm; twisted people do. There is simply no implication from "X believes Y and causes harm" to "Y causes harm".

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You haven't gotten on my nerves. I simply have little patience for going in circles and felt we'd completed enough revolutions on that particular merry-go-round for my taste. I can accept that that (your post above) is what you believe, but I happen to be of the opinion that your beliefs are not supported by anything tangible and are therefore a delusion.

I am more than happy to agree to disagree on that. Perhaps you could begin a thread to express what you feel are legitimate, rational, tangible (what have you), reasons to believe in god(s), or the Christian god in particular. It is guaranteed to generate discussion.

You have loosened your definition of delusion again...but I agree that enough is enough for now. Thanks again for your welcome and the discussion. I'll start some threads explaining my views soon, once I've got a bit more of a feel for the place.

Logikos