Sexual Orientation

[StealthySkeptic]

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So which parts are you talking about changing here? If you mean Orientation, Alice's response is pretty much on the button; you've gotta smash something. If you're talking about Behaviour, there's a large aspect which is self-policed although, once again, Alice's suggestions would work. On the subject of labelling, that's mainly down to social convention: change the conventions and you change the labels.

I thought we were talking about actively modifying someone's sexuality

Oh well XD That one guy had a pretty good idea that I'd spaced with 'pills', which don't require surgery, but are intended for the same general effect

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Way I see it is that you could change just about anything you want about a person if you are determined enough.

And advanced enough.

"Depends on the torture... depends on the man."

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The problem is that young people ~<16 have mostly not developed intellectually enough or gained enough experience to be able to make well-informed choices in sexual matters. That's why Statutory Rape exists, to protect those who might give their consent when they're unknowingly vulnerable.

I find that this applies to adults just as readily. Humankind is a learning being, and their lives shape that learning.

If you wish for them to make "well informed" choices in sexual matters, then it is your duty to inform them as early as possible in their lives.

I think you'll find that by 10, kids are starting to get pretty damn smart.

Personally, I was 'ready' quite early or at least, I thought I was. Actually, I was just horny and acting on it. I now appreciate that I wouldn't have been ready to care for a child or provide for & raise him/her properly. In fact, I would have been woefully inadequate. I still lost my virginity at a young age. I knew better, you see. In reality, I (or the children that never were) was just lucky.

That's what your parents, their grandparents, are for, silly. It's dangerous for humans to go babymaking young... but luckily: medical science is here to catch them now.

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Sexual orientation and behavior is fine until it harms someone. That's basically where the line is drawn.

All about hurt, here. If they're happy, then I'm happy with them... if one person is lording over the other in a nonconsensual and in particular: not enjoyed manner...

Then I have problem. Hedonism, man.

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Well, I guess I can't really imagine a scenario in which an adult who takes advantage of a child for the purposes of exploiting them sexually is going to have any positive effects on the well-being of said child.

And how about an adult who wishes to love that person, to hold them close and teach them all of what they know of the world...

I find that some of my best learning is through practice and exploration. There are advantages to these things.

As Ben pointed out, a child at the age of nine can think they're ready for a lot of things... but they actually don't know what they want because they're nine years old.

A human at age of fifty can believe themselves the manifest of their own destiny... but only are they manifest a fool.

Because... they're human.

I guess I must ask: are you okay with a nine-year-old having sex with an adult if the child pleads and pleads to do it? Say, your daughter?

Yes. Absolutely... though if my daughter were so inclined, I'd prefer it be with me or at least someone I know and trust, who will be as gentle and loving with her as she deserves.

A stranger isn't as trusted, and I would be very hard to convince that I not be around for her safety.

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You at 8 or 9and another 8 or 9 year-old and I wouldn't say boo provided it was consensual--though I think that that's rare, and shouldn't be encouraged.

Consensual sex with people of your own age... not encouraged? Odd.

But an adult and a 8 or 9 year? No way. I don't think given the power difference, that a 8 or 9 year old could really consent. And I don't really think a child is in a position to really understand the possible consequences of sex. You may have been ready, but in order to protect other children, I'd say no.

So... given the 'power difference'... should my relationship with a physically disabled adult be thrown out... shall they not find an outreach for the love they crave? Can they 'really consent', or can they just 'sort of consent', or can they 'not consent' even if the only thing they are speaking is their consent?

The consequences of every action... cause reactions so far-reaching that no man might know their heading. I don't think that an 8 or 9 year old (though perhaps the person is just blissfully stupid, who knows) is incapable of understanding the immediate potential consequences of one subject that, should an adult be on hand at the happenstance, they are dutybound to explain.

Or, perhaps your distrust of the human race has chained the freedoms of man in your mind.

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First of all, a lot of this post left me with my mouth agape, and not in a good way at all.



It seems like you could change someone's sexual orientation with surgery, chemical castration, or the like...the question is, when should you? That is a question best answered by law and psychology.

In the case of, say, homosexuality, when applied to two adults of the same sex, we all know that there is no evidence whatsoever to indicate that consensual homosexuality per se can cause harm. That's why the APA threw it out of the DSM in 1973. On the other hand, pedophilia is a very well known paraphilia (sexual mental illness) that causes a great deal of harm in ALL cases.

Besides, parsing the motives or behavior of the adult and child involved in the act is not necessary, since for very good reasons the law has made statutory rape (the crime that people are really talking about when sex happens where at least one party is under the age of consent) a strict liability crime- meaning an offense where the mens rea (state of mind) of the defendant is not taken into account, only the actus reus (criminal act) itself.

Basically, it DOES NOT matter the supposed "loving" motives of an adult who has sex with a minor under the age of consent in the United States, or indeed most civilized countries (with rare exceptions such as Romeo and Juliet laws where both participants are only a few years apart, so that for instance the 8 and 9 year old in your scenario are not sent to jail, or even a 15 and 16 year old). They are a mentally ill criminal, period, and I personally would never allow my children around sex offenders. Otherwise they could claim love and get out of responsibility for their sick, sick actions.

It DOES NOT matter how "smart" a little kid is for their age. In the eyes of American law and psychology they are NOT responsible enough to make their own decisions in sexual or other matters, otherwise a ten year old could be pressed into signing a contract and then held liable, among other possible ridiculous and harmful situations. In the Middle East, girls can be married as young as 9 but the majority of the time they are forced into it while the adult claims "love" and Islam as far back as Muhammad and Aisha is disgusting for encouraging this for obvious reasons, no matter the "cultural context."

When it comes to adults making stupid decisions, yeah, it happens. However, again, the law doesn't care for a very good reason- ignorance of the law is no excuse. A particular age is the dividing line between responsibility and non-responsibility, period. If you commit an offense as an adult (or a very heinous felony as a young person) you are tried as an adult, stupidity aside. Otherwise people who get drunk and go over the speed limit could blame the alcohol for impairing them.

As for the disabled adult example: no, a physically disabled adult is capable of consenting IF they are intellectually able enough to do so. An intellectually disabled person can consent depending on what they can understand.

When it comes to THIS...

I guess I must ask: are you okay with a nine-year-old having sex with an adult if the child pleads and pleads to do it? Say, your daughter?

Yes. Absolutely... though if my daughter were so inclined, I'd prefer it be with me or at least someone I know and trust, who will be as gentle and loving with her as she deserves.

A stranger isn't as trusted, and I would be very hard to convince that I not be around for her safety.

Uhhhhhhhhhhhhhh...

Uhhhhhhhhhhhhhh...



I will repeat my previous statements from the highest mountain and at the top of my lungs. When it comes to incest (at any age) and pedophilia, motive does not matter. It is wrong in all situations legally, psychologically, and morally, because in the great majority of situations (I'd say >90% but that's out of thin air) it leads to harm for the CHILD.