(August 13, 2014 at 12:53 pm)StealthySkeptic Wrote: I think that all of you definitely have a good point when you say that x hero or y anime character is a Mary or Marty. But what makes someone a Mary or Marty Stu and how do you control this?
An excellent question. Different people will answer differently, since the line can be fuzzy for reasons you articulate. When do you cross the line between "epic story telling" into "someone's day dreams":
Here are some questions I might put on a "Is this character a Mary Sue/Marty Stu" Test:
1. Do the people around the protagonist act with believable motivations or are they cardboard cutouts and sycophants (ala the disciples in the Gospels (oops, there I go again))?
2. Is the protagonist awesomely skilled in a few specific areas of does it seem like he/she can do anything and knows everything, better than even experts in the respective fields? Bonus Mary/Marty points if there's no believable reason such skills should have ever been acquired.
Example: "Will Hunting" might have avoided the Marty Stu label if he was only an intuitive mathematics genius. That he knew everything about everything and better than all the experts is what crosses the line.
3. If the protagonist has super powers/metaphysical abilities/high tech gadgets, are they limited in power and clearly defined or can they do basically whatever the protagonist needs to do at the time?
4. Does the protagonists' love interest (s) have believable motives and a developed character or do they fall in love/lust with the protagonist for no reason? Bonus points if some of these people in love/lust with the protagonist are unnamed or bit parts.
5. Are there other characters of interest or does the protagonist completely dominate the story, as in usually on camera and even when "off camera" he/she is the topic of conversation?
6. Does the protagonist have weaknesses, struggle with anything other than being so awesome, or have any faults (aside from ones that add to his/her appeal such as the 'clumsy' Mary that only is clumsy when falling into the arms of her handsome suitor, or the brooding, edgey Marty) or is the protagonist always cool, perfect and flawless in everything he/she does?
7. Does the protagonist sometimes feel angst about being so awesome and just wants to be "normal"? It doesn't count of not being normal has terrible down sides, like being a vampire.
8. Does the protagonist's story bear strong similarity with the author's biography or nature that bears a strong similarity with the author? Bonus points if the protagonist has the same name as the author.
Feel free to add to this list but the point is there are some important distinctions between "epic" and "oh come on".
Atheist Forums Hall of Shame:
"The trinity can be equated to having your cake and eating it too."
... -Lucent, trying to defend the Trinity concept
"(Yahweh's) actions are good because (Yahweh) is the ultimate standard of goodness. That’s not begging the question"
... -Statler Waldorf, Christian apologist
"The trinity can be equated to having your cake and eating it too."
... -Lucent, trying to defend the Trinity concept
"(Yahweh's) actions are good because (Yahweh) is the ultimate standard of goodness. That’s not begging the question"
... -Statler Waldorf, Christian apologist
