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Can atheists convert theists?
RE: Can atheists convert theists?
(July 20, 2010 at 4:55 pm)Godhead Wrote: I'm not sure I understand your first question about how did I use whatever tools to discover what I've told you. How do I sense god? With intuition. I then question that intuition with reason and reason supports it. In my view it's impossible to have a universe without god, because the universe is god. I can't describe what the universe would be like without god other than to say that there would be nothing.

Let me clarify because you're not being absolutely clear with me about your reasoning.
You tell me that you sensed god with intuition, supported by reason, but I want you to tell me how.
I want to know what you sensed that that you could only reason would be god.

For example, it's like you're telling me that you built a car with a wrench but you don't have a blueprint to show me. If you're familiar with south park, you'll recognize this analogy as well:

intuition and common sense --> ???????? --> GOD!

Do you understand what I'm saying?

I do also have a new question for you: Why do you feel the universe couldn't exist without god?

I'm aware that you feel they are one and the same, but you get zero differing results if I say that the big bang formed the universe and everything we know that is in it, but there is no god.
For example, your equation is this: God = Universe
My equation is this: Universe = Universe
This is because I can observe, measure, and confirm the existence of this universe and I cannot by any sense or machine that I could have available to myself or any other professional to come to any other question. By your definition, mankind cannot test to prove the existence of god, so essentially I don't understand the need to even put such a creature in any equation that, by definition, he cannot be a part of. More to the point, it makes any such concept of god utterly pointless because a) there is no empirical evidence to support that such a high-order intelligence or organism exists in the universe or even that the universe is ordered in any way to support the idea that it is, in itself, an intelligence and b) given that there is zero evidence to support god's existence and his existence would have zero impact on anything in the universe at any point in time, why do you feel the need to waste your mental resources on a belief that is, essentially, completely meaningless?
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Messages In This Thread
Can atheists convert theists? - by Godhead - July 7, 2010 at 9:20 pm
RE: Can atheists convert theists? - by Minimalist - July 7, 2010 at 9:46 pm
RE: Can atheists convert theists? - by Godhead - July 7, 2010 at 9:51 pm
RE: Can atheists convert theists? - by Minimalist - July 7, 2010 at 11:49 pm
RE: Can atheists convert theists? - by Dotard - July 7, 2010 at 11:26 pm
RE: Can atheists convert theists? - by padraic - July 7, 2010 at 11:57 pm
RE: Can atheists convert theists? - by Shell B - July 8, 2010 at 12:04 am
RE: Can atheists convert theists? - by Dotard - July 8, 2010 at 12:07 am
RE: Can atheists convert theists? - by Knight - July 11, 2010 at 9:01 am
RE: Can atheists convert theists? - by strattosphere - July 8, 2010 at 7:50 am
RE: Can atheists convert theists? - by Godhead - July 8, 2010 at 7:52 am
RE: Can atheists convert theists? - by strattosphere - July 8, 2010 at 8:29 am
RE: Can atheists convert theists? - by In This Mind - July 8, 2010 at 11:05 am
RE: Can atheists convert theists? - by Minimalist - July 8, 2010 at 11:45 am
RE: Can atheists convert theists? - by padraic - July 8, 2010 at 8:03 pm
RE: Can atheists convert theists? - by Darwinian - July 8, 2010 at 8:13 am
RE: Can atheists convert theists? - by Eilonnwy - July 8, 2010 at 8:32 am
RE: Can atheists convert theists? - by Godhead - July 8, 2010 at 8:45 am
RE: Can atheists convert theists? - by Eilonnwy - July 8, 2010 at 9:39 am
RE: Can atheists convert theists? - by strattosphere - July 8, 2010 at 10:34 am
RE: Can atheists convert theists? - by Paul the Human - July 8, 2010 at 8:59 am
RE: Can atheists convert theists? - by fr0d0 - July 8, 2010 at 9:52 am
RE: Can atheists convert theists? - by Godhead - July 8, 2010 at 9:58 am
RE: Can atheists convert theists? - by Eilonnwy - July 8, 2010 at 10:08 am
RE: Can atheists convert theists? - by tavarish - July 8, 2010 at 10:12 am
RE: Can atheists convert theists? - by Godhead - July 8, 2010 at 10:39 am
RE: Can atheists convert theists? - by Eilonnwy - July 8, 2010 at 11:01 am
RE: Can atheists convert theists? - by Paul the Human - July 8, 2010 at 11:13 am
RE: Can atheists convert theists? - by strattosphere - July 8, 2010 at 11:24 am
RE: Can atheists convert theists? - by Zen Badger - July 8, 2010 at 10:42 am
RE: Can atheists convert theists? - by Godhead - July 8, 2010 at 11:15 am
RE: Can atheists convert theists? - by Godhead - July 8, 2010 at 11:25 am
RE: Can atheists convert theists? - by strattosphere - July 8, 2010 at 3:22 pm
RE: Can atheists convert theists? - by Paul the Human - July 8, 2010 at 11:27 am
RE: Can atheists convert theists? - by Godhead - July 8, 2010 at 12:01 pm
RE: Can atheists convert theists? - by Paul the Human - July 8, 2010 at 12:19 pm
RE: Can atheists convert theists? - by Godhead - July 8, 2010 at 12:23 pm
RE: Can atheists convert theists? - by In This Mind - July 8, 2010 at 1:31 pm
RE: Can atheists convert theists? - by Paul the Human - July 8, 2010 at 12:34 pm
RE: Can atheists convert theists? - by Godhead - July 8, 2010 at 1:43 pm
RE: Can atheists convert theists? - by In This Mind - July 8, 2010 at 2:11 pm
RE: Can atheists convert theists? - by Godhead - July 8, 2010 at 5:01 pm
RE: Can atheists convert theists? - by In This Mind - July 8, 2010 at 5:51 pm
RE: Can atheists convert theists? - by strattosphere - July 9, 2010 at 10:08 am
RE: Can atheists convert theists? - by Godhead - July 8, 2010 at 6:27 pm
RE: Can atheists convert theists? - by In This Mind - July 8, 2010 at 6:36 pm
RE: Can atheists convert theists? - by Paul the Human - July 8, 2010 at 6:35 pm
RE: Can atheists convert theists? - by Godhead - July 8, 2010 at 7:04 pm
RE: Can atheists convert theists? - by In This Mind - July 8, 2010 at 7:49 pm
RE: Can atheists convert theists? - by Godhead - July 8, 2010 at 7:58 pm
RE: Can atheists convert theists? - by In This Mind - July 8, 2010 at 8:08 pm
RE: Can atheists convert theists? - by Godhead - July 8, 2010 at 8:12 pm
RE: Can atheists convert theists? - by In This Mind - July 8, 2010 at 9:22 pm
RE: Can atheists convert theists? - by Godhead - July 8, 2010 at 9:31 pm
RE: Can atheists convert theists? - by In This Mind - July 8, 2010 at 9:42 pm
RE: Can atheists convert theists? - by Godhead - July 8, 2010 at 9:47 pm
RE: Can atheists convert theists? - by In This Mind - July 8, 2010 at 9:49 pm
RE: Can atheists convert theists? - by Godhead - July 8, 2010 at 9:51 pm
RE: Can atheists convert theists? - by In This Mind - July 8, 2010 at 10:00 pm
RE: Can atheists convert theists? - by Godhead - July 8, 2010 at 10:02 pm
RE: Can atheists convert theists? - by Loki_999 - July 9, 2010 at 2:13 am
RE: Can atheists convert theists? - by KichigaiNeko - July 9, 2010 at 4:16 am
RE: Can atheists convert theists? - by Godhead - July 9, 2010 at 10:34 am
RE: Can atheists convert theists? - by strattosphere - July 9, 2010 at 12:14 pm
RE: Can atheists convert theists? - by Godhead - July 9, 2010 at 12:39 pm
RE: Can atheists convert theists? - by strattosphere - July 9, 2010 at 3:08 pm
RE: Can atheists convert theists? - by Godhead - July 10, 2010 at 12:16 pm
RE: Can atheists convert theists? - by Paul the Human - July 10, 2010 at 2:55 pm
RE: Can atheists convert theists? - by strattosphere - July 10, 2010 at 5:29 pm
RE: Can atheists convert theists? - by Samson - July 10, 2010 at 2:47 pm
RE: Can atheists convert theists? - by Godhead - July 10, 2010 at 5:28 pm
RE: Can atheists convert theists? - by Godhead - July 10, 2010 at 5:32 pm
RE: Can atheists convert theists? - by In This Mind - July 10, 2010 at 6:16 pm
RE: Can atheists convert theists? - by Godhead - July 10, 2010 at 6:20 pm
RE: Can atheists convert theists? - by In This Mind - July 10, 2010 at 6:25 pm
RE: Can atheists convert theists? - by Godhead - July 10, 2010 at 6:28 pm
RE: Can atheists convert theists? - by In This Mind - July 10, 2010 at 6:32 pm
RE: Can atheists convert theists? - by Godhead - July 10, 2010 at 6:38 pm
RE: Can atheists convert theists? - by In This Mind - July 10, 2010 at 6:45 pm
RE: Can atheists convert theists? - by Godhead - July 10, 2010 at 7:02 pm
RE: Can atheists convert theists? - by In This Mind - July 10, 2010 at 9:07 pm
RE: Can atheists convert theists? - by Autumnlicious - July 10, 2010 at 8:19 pm
RE: Can atheists convert theists? - by Godhead - July 10, 2010 at 8:21 pm
RE: Can atheists convert theists? - by Godhead - July 10, 2010 at 9:14 pm
RE: Can atheists convert theists? - by In This Mind - July 10, 2010 at 9:18 pm
RE: Can atheists convert theists? - by Godhead - July 10, 2010 at 9:21 pm
RE: Can atheists convert theists? - by In This Mind - July 10, 2010 at 10:35 pm
RE: Can atheists convert theists? - by Edwardo Piet - July 11, 2010 at 6:14 am
RE: Can atheists convert theists? - by In This Mind - July 11, 2010 at 10:16 am
RE: Can atheists convert theists? - by Paul the Human - July 11, 2010 at 10:37 am
RE: Can atheists convert theists? - by Godhead - July 11, 2010 at 11:20 am
RE: Can atheists convert theists? - by Paul the Human - July 11, 2010 at 12:07 pm
RE: Can atheists convert theists? - by Scented Nectar - July 11, 2010 at 11:30 am
RE: Can atheists convert theists? - by Knight - July 11, 2010 at 12:29 pm
RE: Can atheists convert theists? - by Godhead - July 11, 2010 at 12:26 pm
RE: Can atheists convert theists? - by Paul the Human - July 11, 2010 at 12:29 pm
RE: Can atheists convert theists? - by Godhead - July 11, 2010 at 1:07 pm
RE: Can atheists convert theists? - by Paul the Human - July 11, 2010 at 1:25 pm
RE: Can atheists convert theists? - by Minimalist - July 11, 2010 at 1:24 pm
RE: Can atheists convert theists? - by Scented Nectar - July 11, 2010 at 1:48 pm
RE: Can atheists convert theists? - by Knight - July 11, 2010 at 2:17 pm
RE: Can atheists convert theists? - by Welsh cake - July 11, 2010 at 2:51 pm
RE: Can atheists convert theists? - by Knight - July 11, 2010 at 3:22 pm
RE: Can atheists convert theists? - by Edwardo Piet - July 11, 2010 at 4:12 pm
RE: Can atheists convert theists? - by Paul the Human - July 11, 2010 at 4:17 pm
RE: Can atheists convert theists? - by Edwardo Piet - July 11, 2010 at 4:35 pm
RE: Can atheists convert theists? - by Paul the Human - July 11, 2010 at 4:38 pm
RE: Can atheists convert theists? - by Edwardo Piet - July 11, 2010 at 4:41 pm
RE: Can atheists convert theists? - by Paul the Human - July 11, 2010 at 4:42 pm
RE: Can atheists convert theists? - by Edwardo Piet - July 11, 2010 at 4:52 pm
RE: Can atheists convert theists? - by Godhead - July 11, 2010 at 5:00 pm
RE: Can atheists convert theists? - by fr0d0 - July 11, 2010 at 7:22 pm
RE: Can atheists convert theists? - by Edwardo Piet - July 11, 2010 at 7:24 pm
RE: Can atheists convert theists? - by fr0d0 - July 11, 2010 at 7:27 pm
RE: Can atheists convert theists? - by Edwardo Piet - July 11, 2010 at 7:31 pm
RE: Can atheists convert theists? - by fr0d0 - July 11, 2010 at 7:34 pm
RE: Can atheists convert theists? - by Godhead - July 11, 2010 at 7:32 pm
RE: Can atheists convert theists? - by Edwardo Piet - July 11, 2010 at 7:36 pm
RE: Can atheists convert theists? - by fr0d0 - July 11, 2010 at 7:40 pm
RE: Can atheists convert theists? - by Godhead - July 11, 2010 at 7:40 pm
RE: Can atheists convert theists? - by Edwardo Piet - July 11, 2010 at 7:42 pm
RE: Can atheists convert theists? - by fr0d0 - July 11, 2010 at 7:47 pm
RE: Can atheists convert theists? - by Godhead - July 11, 2010 at 7:50 pm
RE: Can atheists convert theists? - by Knight - July 11, 2010 at 8:30 pm
RE: Can atheists convert theists? - by Godhead - July 11, 2010 at 8:36 pm
RE: Can atheists convert theists? - by Knight - July 11, 2010 at 8:55 pm
RE: Can atheists convert theists? - by Godhead - July 11, 2010 at 9:16 pm
RE: Can atheists convert theists? - by Knight - July 11, 2010 at 9:24 pm
RE: Can atheists convert theists? - by Godhead - July 11, 2010 at 9:27 pm
RE: Can atheists convert theists? - by Edwardo Piet - July 12, 2010 at 5:14 am
RE: Can atheists convert theists? - by Purple Rabbit - July 12, 2010 at 1:20 pm
RE: Can atheists convert theists? - by Knight - July 12, 2010 at 1:25 pm
RE: Can atheists convert theists? - by Edwardo Piet - July 12, 2010 at 1:54 pm
RE: Can atheists convert theists? - by Purple Rabbit - July 12, 2010 at 2:47 pm
RE: Can atheists convert theists? - by Edwardo Piet - July 12, 2010 at 4:02 pm
RE: Can atheists convert theists? - by Purple Rabbit - July 12, 2010 at 5:16 pm
RE: Can atheists convert theists? - by Edwardo Piet - July 12, 2010 at 6:47 pm
RE: Can atheists convert theists? - by Knight - July 12, 2010 at 6:49 am
RE: Can atheists convert theists? - by Edwardo Piet - July 12, 2010 at 7:55 am
RE: Can atheists convert theists? - by Knight - July 12, 2010 at 8:15 am
RE: Can atheists convert theists? - by Godhead - July 12, 2010 at 7:11 am
RE: Can atheists convert theists? - by Knight - July 12, 2010 at 7:44 am
RE: Can atheists convert theists? - by Edwardo Piet - July 12, 2010 at 8:52 am
RE: Can atheists convert theists? - by Knight - July 12, 2010 at 12:37 pm
RE: Can atheists convert theists? - by Edwardo Piet - July 12, 2010 at 12:47 pm
RE: Can atheists convert theists? - by Knight - July 12, 2010 at 1:01 pm
RE: Can atheists convert theists? - by Edwardo Piet - July 12, 2010 at 1:13 pm
RE: Can atheists convert theists? - by Knight - July 12, 2010 at 7:15 pm
RE: Can atheists convert theists? - by Edwardo Piet - July 13, 2010 at 5:32 am
RE: Can atheists convert theists? - by Knight - July 13, 2010 at 6:30 am
RE: Can atheists convert theists? - by Edwardo Piet - July 13, 2010 at 6:48 am
RE: Can atheists convert theists? - by Purple Rabbit - July 13, 2010 at 1:40 pm
RE: Can atheists convert theists? - by Edwardo Piet - July 16, 2010 at 6:21 am
RE: Can atheists convert theists? - by TheDarkestOfAngels - July 18, 2010 at 11:35 pm
RE: Can atheists convert theists? - by Godhead - July 19, 2010 at 7:49 am
RE: Can atheists convert theists? - by theVOID - July 19, 2010 at 5:22 pm
RE: Can atheists convert theists? - by Godhead - July 19, 2010 at 5:23 pm
RE: Can atheists convert theists? - by AtheistPhil - July 19, 2010 at 6:32 pm
RE: Can atheists convert theists? - by Ace Otana - July 19, 2010 at 5:25 pm
RE: Can atheists convert theists? - by CoolBoy - July 19, 2010 at 7:04 pm
RE: Can atheists convert theists? - by Godhead - July 19, 2010 at 8:05 pm
RE: Can atheists convert theists? - by theVOID - July 19, 2010 at 8:48 pm
RE: Can atheists convert theists? - by Ace Otana - July 19, 2010 at 8:47 pm
RE: Can atheists convert theists? - by Godhead - July 19, 2010 at 8:54 pm
RE: Can atheists convert theists? - by theVOID - July 19, 2010 at 9:10 pm
RE: Can atheists convert theists? - by Godhead - July 19, 2010 at 9:13 pm
RE: Can atheists convert theists? - by theVOID - July 19, 2010 at 9:20 pm
RE: Can atheists convert theists? - by Godhead - July 19, 2010 at 9:23 pm
RE: Can atheists convert theists? - by theVOID - July 19, 2010 at 9:25 pm
RE: Can atheists convert theists? - by Godhead - July 19, 2010 at 9:27 pm
RE: Can atheists convert theists? - by theVOID - July 19, 2010 at 9:29 pm
RE: Can atheists convert theists? - by Edwardo Piet - July 20, 2010 at 4:51 am
RE: Can atheists convert theists? - by Ace Otana - July 20, 2010 at 5:12 am
RE: Can atheists convert theists? - by Godhead - July 20, 2010 at 7:38 am
RE: Can atheists convert theists? - by Ace Otana - July 20, 2010 at 9:51 am
RE: Can atheists convert theists? - by TheDarkestOfAngels - July 20, 2010 at 12:11 pm
RE: Can atheists convert theists? - by Godhead - July 20, 2010 at 11:17 am
RE: Can atheists convert theists? - by Ace Otana - July 20, 2010 at 12:58 pm
RE: Can atheists convert theists? - by Godhead - July 20, 2010 at 12:33 pm
RE: Can atheists convert theists? - by Godhead - July 20, 2010 at 4:55 pm
RE: Can atheists convert theists? - by TheDarkestOfAngels - July 20, 2010 at 6:51 pm
RE: Can atheists convert theists? - by Cego_Colher - July 20, 2010 at 5:14 pm
RE: Can atheists convert theists? - by Godhead - July 20, 2010 at 5:31 pm
RE: Can atheists convert theists? - by Godhead - July 20, 2010 at 7:24 pm
RE: Can atheists convert theists? - by Rhizomorph13 - July 20, 2010 at 11:00 pm

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