(January 5, 2015 at 8:07 pm)*steve* Wrote: Hello, I'm new to the forum. Full disclosure: I'm currently a non-traditional theist. However, I have considered atheism a few times but it seems to be such a grim position. Let me explain.
As I understand atheism, these would be a few of its tenets:
There is no ultimate meaning. Therefore, all lives and events are ultimately meaningless.
There is no ultimate basis for value. Therefore any moral position is ultimately arbitrary and logically, equally defensible. This means that things like genocide, pedophilia, torture, etc. are equally defensible to any other moral position.
There is no ultimate intentionality associated with/in reality. Therefore, all events, actions, thoughts and behaviors are determined by chance and necessity. Thus, an individual's thoughts and actions are determined solely by prior causal events and chance.
At least for me, if I take these atheist positions to their logical conclusion this all seems psychologically pretty grim.
I'd be interested in comments why this is not necessarily the case.
I get so tired of this crap. Please think before you post. Please understand, and to an future theist posting here, don't think we have not seen these arguments before.
Context matters.
In the scope of 5 billion years from now, no, what happens now is meaningless to the future when the planet and sun die.
But as far as our time while we are alive as individuals yes our lives have meaning. I find it absurd to think because we are finite we cannot enjoy the finite time we have.
Do you mourn the death of a tree or cockroach? Do you mourn the thought of your non existence before you were born? So why would the thought of your non existence be anymore frightening? It would be like being scared of the seasons changing. It is going to happen like it or not.
Atheists have the same ups and downs in life as believers. We feel pain, and have lost loved ones and pets and friends. Evolution is why life continues even though it is finite. There is no magic or god needed to explain reality.
We can and do find happiness in the here and now. That is not fatalistic or "grim" accepting reality. It merely means you accept reality.
If you want "grim" the childish bully of a god who throws all non fans in a lake of fire for not kissing his ass in an act of genocide, that is
"grim". And god doesn't simply kill you, if you do not kiss his ass you get tortured eternity. Now that is "grim". I am glad god/s are not real, but the fans who believe in this fictional sky bully do scare me.
Nature both in life in the universe has a cycle and merely accepting life as finite is positive because it allows you to view reality without fear.
