I work in software development and everybody in my team are athiests. They also seem to be quite open to discussion and try to discuss intelligently addressing the points that are being debated. This contrasts with almost every reply here where not one of you have refuted any of the single points I have made rather you have just resorted to cheap insults and comments without any intellectual basis at all. Pretty much sums you all up.
I dont think I have read a single reasonably intelligent post yet. You even agree with me on some points yet you then contradict yourself:
"Science isn't a religion, its not a belief system, it is none of the things you describe, its observation, hypothesis, testing, analyzing, concluding. So far science has proven itself at being adept at modeling how and why the universe works. That's ALL. Scientific methods can be applied to claims of God's impact, not to God itself, and no scientist attempts to put God to the test, there's nothing to test, as you say. But the claims by adherents can be examined and are largely proven wrong, hardly credible evidence to put faith in a creator."
I did not say science is a religion or a belief system so stop putting words into my mouth. Moreover I clearly agreed with you about it being 'adept at modeling how and why the universe works. That's ALL' when I said it rocks at dealing with tangible phenomenon'. Therefore you have made no point at all but rather showed you agree with me. This is not about how the universe works this is about the cause behind the universe.
You obviously agree that were there to be an unlimited independent creator science would not be able to test it since it only deals with tangible matter sunjected to cause and effect. I have clearly stated the logic behind why a creator with the attributes I have mentioned must be the cause but you have not shown how this logic is false.
"It's only uncomplicated if you insert God for the real answers to the hard questions"
You are right it is uncomplicated if you insert the creator because that is the only possible solution. There is no other possible explanantion in the same way that x+3=5 cannot be anything other then 2. Anybody who says x is other then 2 is stupid, complicating matters for himself, retarded, in complete denial etc. Perhaps it is that you are in denial do not want to accept the existence of God because of the implications it will have on your lifes or perhaps your minds are in agreement with God but your hearts are not. You can deny x being 2 in the above equation all you like but that will not change the truth.
How pathetic nobody has even refuted one of the points I have made and shown how the logic I have used is weak or void. Throughout the entire quran it tells people not to follow tradition, ignorance, arrogance etc but rather to contemplate everything around them and deduce the existence of a creator. Indeed the quran states those people who do so are those ".....who have sense".
I dont think I have read a single reasonably intelligent post yet. You even agree with me on some points yet you then contradict yourself:
"Science isn't a religion, its not a belief system, it is none of the things you describe, its observation, hypothesis, testing, analyzing, concluding. So far science has proven itself at being adept at modeling how and why the universe works. That's ALL. Scientific methods can be applied to claims of God's impact, not to God itself, and no scientist attempts to put God to the test, there's nothing to test, as you say. But the claims by adherents can be examined and are largely proven wrong, hardly credible evidence to put faith in a creator."
I did not say science is a religion or a belief system so stop putting words into my mouth. Moreover I clearly agreed with you about it being 'adept at modeling how and why the universe works. That's ALL' when I said it rocks at dealing with tangible phenomenon'. Therefore you have made no point at all but rather showed you agree with me. This is not about how the universe works this is about the cause behind the universe.
You obviously agree that were there to be an unlimited independent creator science would not be able to test it since it only deals with tangible matter sunjected to cause and effect. I have clearly stated the logic behind why a creator with the attributes I have mentioned must be the cause but you have not shown how this logic is false.
"It's only uncomplicated if you insert God for the real answers to the hard questions"
You are right it is uncomplicated if you insert the creator because that is the only possible solution. There is no other possible explanantion in the same way that x+3=5 cannot be anything other then 2. Anybody who says x is other then 2 is stupid, complicating matters for himself, retarded, in complete denial etc. Perhaps it is that you are in denial do not want to accept the existence of God because of the implications it will have on your lifes or perhaps your minds are in agreement with God but your hearts are not. You can deny x being 2 in the above equation all you like but that will not change the truth.
How pathetic nobody has even refuted one of the points I have made and shown how the logic I have used is weak or void. Throughout the entire quran it tells people not to follow tradition, ignorance, arrogance etc but rather to contemplate everything around them and deduce the existence of a creator. Indeed the quran states those people who do so are those ".....who have sense".
