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What IS good, and how do we determine it?
RE: What IS good, and how do we determine it?
Sorry to but in, but you are being a hair silly.

(June 21, 2015 at 10:05 am)Won2blv Wrote: So would you classify every soldier in that has died as a suicide? No? Because it wasn't intentional? What if a soldier was surrounded by the enemy and had no way out but to take down as many of them with him and just stormed out with guns blazing? There are instances where you could say that the soldier was committing "suicide" but no one would even think to imply that to his grieving family.

The soldiers in your scenarios all don't intend to die.  I doubt many soldiers go out with the intention of dying.  It's a risk of course, even an extreme likelihood in some cases, but not a certainty and certainly not an intention.

Now compare the arrest and crucifixion of Jesus (assume of course that he does have supernatural powers).  He has the power to stop the Roman soldiers at anytime without hurting them or risking anyone's life, yet he lets them take him away and nail him up.

If the soldiers in your scenarios were armed to the teeth but dropped their weapons stood still and let civilians cut them up with bread knives it'd much closer to equivalent.

(June 21, 2015 at 10:05 am)Won2blv Wrote: And even if you could parse and find a way to say that the soldiers death by definition was a suicide it would not change the fact that his death had a justified cause.

World War II saw a number of suicide bombers.  They flew out of the range of return on purpose knowing full well that they would die in the process of dropping their payload.  Currently, suicide bombers are perpetually in the news.  The modern kind often even has their own death as a goal.  Both kinds of suicide bombers have what at least they themselves think are laudable goals,  but it's still suicide.

(June 21, 2015 at 10:05 am)Won2blv Wrote: Jesus did not kill himself and he never would have. Saying it was a suicide is like saying every soldier that has died in combat committed suicide since they knew of the possible outcome

Jesus, as told by Mathew knew perfectly well he was going to die.  It appears to have been the plan.

Quote:From that time on, Jesus began to show his disciples that he must go to Jerusalem and undergo great suffering at the hands of the elders and chief priests and scribes, and be killed, and on the third day be raised. 22 And Peter took him aside and began to rebuke him, saying, ‘God forbid it, Lord! This must never happen to you.’ 23 But he turned and said to Peter, ‘Get behind me, Satan! You are a stumbling-block to me; for you are setting your mind not on divine things but on human things.’
Mathew 16:21-23

Quote:22 As they were gathering[h] in Galilee, Jesus said to them, ‘The Son of Man is going to be betrayed into human hands, 23 and they will kill him, and on the third day he will be raised.’ And they were greatly distressed.
Mathew 17:22-23
If there is a god, I want to believe that there is a god.  If there is not a god, I want to believe that there is no god.
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Messages In This Thread
RE: What IS good, and how do we determine it? - by Silver - June 15, 2015 at 10:06 pm
RE: What IS good, and how do we determine it? - by Silver - June 15, 2015 at 10:09 pm
RE: What IS good, and how do we determine it? - by Silver - June 15, 2015 at 10:19 pm
RE: What IS good, and how do we determine it? - by abaris - June 16, 2015 at 12:13 pm
RE: What IS good, and how do we determine it? - by Cato - June 16, 2015 at 1:05 pm
RE: What IS good, and how do we determine it? - by Nope - June 15, 2015 at 7:41 pm
RE: What IS good, and how do we determine it? - by Nope - June 15, 2015 at 10:34 pm
RE: What IS good, and how do we determine it? - by IATIA - June 16, 2015 at 12:55 am
RE: What IS good, and how do we determine it? - by Nope - June 16, 2015 at 6:22 am
RE: What IS good, and how do we determine it? - by Silver - June 15, 2015 at 11:23 pm
RE: What IS good, and how do we determine it? - by Silver - June 15, 2015 at 11:40 pm
RE: What IS good, and how do we determine it? - by Silver - June 16, 2015 at 12:04 am
RE: What IS good, and how do we determine it? - by Silver - June 16, 2015 at 12:22 am
RE: What IS good, and how do we determine it? - by Silver - June 16, 2015 at 12:49 am
RE: What IS good, and how do we determine it? - by Silver - June 16, 2015 at 12:32 am
RE: What IS good, and how do we determine it? - by Silver - June 16, 2015 at 12:46 am
RE: What IS good, and how do we determine it? - by Silver - June 16, 2015 at 12:54 am
RE: What IS good, and how do we determine it? - by abaris - June 16, 2015 at 11:57 am
RE: What IS good, and how do we determine it? - by abaris - June 16, 2015 at 12:31 pm
RE: What IS good, and how do we determine it? - by Nope - June 17, 2015 at 8:33 am
RE: What IS good, and how do we determine it? - by Cato - June 16, 2015 at 10:24 am
RE: What IS good, and how do we determine it? - by abaris - June 16, 2015 at 10:48 am
RE: What IS good, and how do we determine it? - by Nope - June 17, 2015 at 8:24 am
RE: What IS good, and how do we determine it? - by abaris - June 16, 2015 at 12:43 pm
RE: What IS good, and how do we determine it? - by Cato - June 16, 2015 at 12:56 pm
RE: What IS good, and how do we determine it? - by Cato - June 16, 2015 at 3:39 pm
RE: What IS good, and how do we determine it? - by Cato - June 16, 2015 at 4:32 pm
RE: What IS good, and how do we determine it? - by Silver - June 16, 2015 at 10:18 pm
RE: What IS good, and how do we determine it? - by Pyrrho - June 16, 2015 at 10:04 pm
RE: What IS good, and how do we determine it? - by Silver - June 17, 2015 at 12:46 am
RE: What IS good, and how do we determine it? - by Nope - June 17, 2015 at 6:30 pm
RE: What IS good, and how do we determine it? - by Nope - June 18, 2015 at 10:18 am
RE: What IS good, and how do we determine it? - by abaris - June 18, 2015 at 11:14 am
RE: What IS good, and how do we determine it? - by Nope - June 17, 2015 at 8:56 am
RE: What IS good, and how do we determine it? - by Nope - June 17, 2015 at 9:14 am
RE: What IS good, and how do we determine it? - by Nope - June 17, 2015 at 9:20 am
RE: What IS good, and how do we determine it? - by Nope - June 17, 2015 at 4:35 pm
RE: What IS good, and how do we determine it? - by Nope - June 17, 2015 at 4:41 pm
RE: What IS good, and how do we determine it? - by Nope - June 17, 2015 at 7:13 pm
RE: What IS good, and how do we determine it? - by Nope - June 17, 2015 at 8:58 pm
RE: What IS good, and how do we determine it? - by Nope - June 17, 2015 at 9:05 pm
RE: What IS good, and how do we determine it? - by Nope - June 19, 2015 at 9:56 pm
RE: What IS good, and how do we determine it? - by abaris - June 20, 2015 at 11:52 am
RE: What IS good, and how do we determine it? - by Nope - June 20, 2015 at 12:07 pm
RE: What IS good, and how do we determine it? - by Nope - June 20, 2015 at 2:50 pm
RE: What IS good, and how do we determine it? - by Nope - June 19, 2015 at 11:03 am
RE: What IS good, and how do we determine it? - by abaris - June 19, 2015 at 11:18 am
RE: What IS good, and how do we determine it? - by Pyrrho - June 17, 2015 at 10:07 pm
RE: What IS good, and how do we determine it? - by Nope - June 17, 2015 at 8:52 pm
RE: What IS good, and how do we determine it? - by Nope - June 17, 2015 at 11:49 pm
RE: What IS good, and how do we determine it? - by Nope - June 17, 2015 at 11:41 pm
RE: What IS good, and how do we determine it? - by abaris - June 18, 2015 at 11:18 am
RE: What IS good, and how do we determine it? - by abaris - June 18, 2015 at 11:59 am
RE: What IS good, and how do we determine it? - by Alex K - June 18, 2015 at 11:24 am
RE: What IS good, and how do we determine it? - by Nope - June 19, 2015 at 8:16 am
RE: What IS good, and how do we determine it? - by Nope - June 19, 2015 at 1:11 pm
RE: What IS good, and how do we determine it? - by Nope - June 19, 2015 at 7:08 pm
RE: What IS good, and how do we determine it? - by Cato - June 19, 2015 at 6:14 pm
RE: What IS good, and how do we determine it? - by Nope - June 19, 2015 at 8:18 am
RE: What IS good, and how do we determine it? - by Nope - June 19, 2015 at 9:52 am
RE: What IS good, and how do we determine it? - by abaris - June 19, 2015 at 10:50 am
RE: What IS good, and how do we determine it? - by Nope - June 19, 2015 at 12:58 pm
RE: What IS good, and how do we determine it? - by Cato - June 20, 2015 at 9:03 am
RE: What IS good, and how do we determine it? - by Nope - June 20, 2015 at 8:54 am
RE: What IS good, and how do we determine it? - by Cato - June 20, 2015 at 3:03 pm
RE: What IS good, and how do we determine it? - by IATIA - June 21, 2015 at 10:20 am
RE: What IS good, and how do we determine it? - by Jenny A - June 21, 2015 at 10:41 am
RE: What IS good, and how do we determine it? - by Pyrrho - June 20, 2015 at 11:31 pm
RE: What IS good, and how do we determine it? - by Cato - June 20, 2015 at 3:53 pm
RE: What IS good, and how do we determine it? - by Nope - June 21, 2015 at 12:20 pm
RE: What IS good, and how do we determine it? - by Nope - June 21, 2015 at 11:27 am
RE: What IS good, and how do we determine it? - by Nope - June 21, 2015 at 1:16 pm
RE: What IS good, and how do we determine it? - by abaris - June 21, 2015 at 11:55 am
RE: What IS good, and how do we determine it? - by Metis - June 21, 2015 at 12:27 pm
RE: What IS good, and how do we determine it? - by Nope - June 21, 2015 at 2:21 pm
RE: What IS good, and how do we determine it? - by Nope - June 21, 2015 at 9:08 pm
RE: What IS good, and how do we determine it? - by Metis - June 21, 2015 at 12:14 pm
RE: What IS good, and how do we determine it? - by Nope - June 21, 2015 at 9:12 pm
RE: What IS good, and how do we determine it? - by Nope - June 21, 2015 at 9:37 pm
RE: What IS good, and how do we determine it? - by IATIA - June 23, 2015 at 12:41 am
RE: What IS good, and how do we determine it? - by abaris - June 21, 2015 at 10:23 am
RE: What IS good, and how do we determine it? - by Pyrrho - June 21, 2015 at 11:42 am
RE: What IS good, and how do we determine it? - by Nope - June 21, 2015 at 12:33 pm
RE: What IS good, and how do we determine it? - by Nope - June 21, 2015 at 1:26 pm
RE: What IS good, and how do we determine it? - by Nope - June 21, 2015 at 1:24 pm
RE: What IS good, and how do we determine it? - by Nope - June 21, 2015 at 2:04 pm
RE: What IS good, and how do we determine it? - by Metis - June 24, 2015 at 10:24 pm
RE: What IS good, and how do we determine it? - by Metis - June 25, 2015 at 12:18 pm
RE: What IS good, and how do we determine it? - by abaris - June 25, 2015 at 11:08 am
RE: What IS good, and how do we determine it? - by Nope - June 22, 2015 at 11:18 am
RE: What IS good, and how do we determine it? - by Nope - June 22, 2015 at 1:25 pm
RE: What IS good, and how do we determine it? - by abaris - June 23, 2015 at 12:57 am
RE: What IS good, and how do we determine it? - by Nope - June 23, 2015 at 6:24 pm
RE: What IS good, and how do we determine it? - by Nope - June 24, 2015 at 7:23 am
RE: What IS good, and how do we determine it? - by Nope - June 24, 2015 at 6:12 pm
RE: What IS good, and how do we determine it? - by Nope - June 24, 2015 at 6:03 pm
RE: What IS good, and how do we determine it? - by Nope - June 24, 2015 at 6:24 pm
RE: What IS good, and how do we determine it? - by Nope - June 24, 2015 at 6:29 pm
RE: What IS good, and how do we determine it? - by Cato - June 24, 2015 at 10:54 pm
RE: What IS good, and how do we determine it? - by Nope - June 26, 2015 at 7:14 am
RE: What IS good, and how do we determine it? - by abaris - June 26, 2015 at 10:58 am
RE: What IS good, and how do we determine it? - by Nope - June 24, 2015 at 8:06 pm
RE: What IS good, and how do we determine it? - by Metis - June 24, 2015 at 10:03 pm
RE: What IS good, and how do we determine it? - by Metis - June 24, 2015 at 10:11 pm
RE: What IS good, and how do we determine it? - by Cato - June 25, 2015 at 12:39 am
RE: What IS good, and how do we determine it? - by Nope - June 26, 2015 at 7:05 am
RE: What IS good, and how do we determine it? - by Tonus - June 25, 2015 at 11:00 am
RE: What IS good, and how do we determine it? - by abaris - June 26, 2015 at 11:21 am
RE: What IS good, and how do we determine it? - by abaris - June 26, 2015 at 12:35 pm
RE: What IS good, and how do we determine it? - by Pyrrho - June 26, 2015 at 12:51 pm
RE: What IS good, and how do we determine it? - by abaris - June 26, 2015 at 12:58 pm
RE: What IS good, and how do we determine it? - by abaris - June 27, 2015 at 12:07 pm
RE: What IS good, and how do we determine it? - by Pyrrho - June 26, 2015 at 10:16 pm
RE: What IS good, and how do we determine it? - by Nope - June 28, 2015 at 9:31 pm
RE: What IS good, and how do we determine it? - by Cato - June 28, 2015 at 11:14 pm
RE: What IS good, and how do we determine it? - by Cato - June 30, 2015 at 7:06 pm
RE: What IS good, and how do we determine it? - by Cato - June 30, 2015 at 5:52 pm
RE: What IS good, and how do we determine it? - by Cato - June 30, 2015 at 2:55 pm
RE: What IS good, and how do we determine it? - by Cato - June 30, 2015 at 6:59 pm
RE: What IS good, and how do we determine it? - by Nope - June 27, 2015 at 8:00 am
RE: What IS good, and how do we determine it? - by Nope - June 27, 2015 at 12:51 pm
RE: What IS good, and how do we determine it? - by Nope - June 27, 2015 at 1:56 pm
RE: What IS good, and how do we determine it? - by IATIA - June 27, 2015 at 12:58 pm
RE: What IS good, and how do we determine it? - by Cato - July 1, 2015 at 11:29 pm
RE: What IS good, and how do we determine it? - by Cato - July 1, 2015 at 11:46 pm
RE: What IS good, and how do we determine it? - by smax - June 29, 2015 at 1:40 pm
What IS good, and how do we determine it? - by Easy Guns - June 29, 2015 at 10:06 pm
RE: What IS good, and how do we determine it? - by Nope - June 30, 2015 at 8:52 am
What IS good, and how do we determine it? - by Easy Guns - June 29, 2015 at 10:34 pm
What IS good, and how do we determine it? - by Easy Guns - June 29, 2015 at 10:47 pm
RE: What IS good, and how do we determine it? - by IATIA - June 29, 2015 at 10:49 pm
What IS good, and how do we determine it? - by Easy Guns - June 30, 2015 at 10:43 am
RE: What IS good, and how do we determine it? - by Cato - July 2, 2015 at 12:51 pm
RE: What IS good, and how do we determine it? - by Joods - July 10, 2015 at 12:11 am

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