Our server costs ~$56 per month to run. Please consider donating or becoming a Patron to help keep the site running. Help us gain new members by following us on Twitter and liking our page on Facebook!
Current time: April 27, 2024, 2:21 pm

Poll: Regarding Over-Population
This poll is closed.
Moderate to radical worldwide population controls are imperative at this point..
26.19%
11 26.19%
Population controls are a violation of human rights.
16.67%
7 16.67%
I think better education about over population is all we need.
40.48%
17 40.48%
Other ... see my post.
16.67%
7 16.67%
Total 42 vote(s) 100%
* You voted for this item. [Show Results]

Thread Rating:
  • 0 Vote(s) - 0 Average
  • 1
  • 2
  • 3
  • 4
  • 5
The Need to Breed
#31
RE: The Need to Breed
(August 13, 2012 at 11:58 pm)Rhythm Wrote: Therein lies the rub, no one would be forcing any government to kill anyone. The whole killing folks bit would remain as optional then as it is now. Why shouldn't the enforcers of this population control scheme just kill themselves to make way for a newborn? Laying aside my constant criticism of the idea of population control on the basis of faulty benchmarks - lets assume that we absolutely and unequivocally reached our limit. Leys assume that we could do no more, that we where stretched to threads. At that point, would we start enforcing this policy by violence? Well, judging by our sad history in this regard, probably. Let's be honest, we can't even seem to keep our hands out of each others pockets except by force, ultimately. Even petty crimes which do nothing to imperil humanity as a whole continue unabated. At that point (the point where we leverage force), let me ask you what would be worth saving Cinjin? In a world where human life is so many beans to be counted, what do we have to offer?

To me, the solutions we are likely to field for this problem, no matter how near or distant are so utterly dehumanizing that they leave me asking "who the fuck cares"? I could never tell someone that they just cant have another child. Couldn't bring myself to do it. I wouldn't listen if someone told me that I couldn't have another child. "The greater good" sounds awfully goddamned shitty in that scenario, definitely isn't a pitch that would work on me.

Now, as far as why people have children. It is pretty wel established that economically dis-advatanged people tend to have more children. I do recall reading about a couple of interesting programs on that front (the location escapes me but you might be able to find more info). The quote "A tree is better than a son" stuck with me from one article I read about one program. However interesting outlayers aside having a large number of offspring is still a viable survival strategy for people with nothing. Kids (despite all the common wisdom to the contrary) are cheap.


Actually, I find that sentiment totally fair. What exactly is worth saving if we are forced to kill each other to do it? I don't know. And my point with Epimethean is that I don't believe there is an answer that will keep people from breeding. I don't want to tell people to stop breeding either, but that doesn't change the fact that that is exactly what needs to happen. It's easy for us, and even easier for our grandfathers, to scoff at voluntary sterilization, but 50/60/70 years from now, those 30-something parents with 6 year olds are going to be desperate to give their offspring a future ... and it'll be too late.
I wonder if they will be saying "who the fuck cares" or if they will endorse the idea of forcing the next generation (or some other country) to cease all procreation. Probably not. Instead they'll probably just nuke the problem. It's far quicker and easier just to blame the "guiltier" parties and blow 'em off the face of the earth for the good of society.
In the end, there is no easy fix and there sure as hell is no moral right. There's only the question, do we want to save the human race at any cost? Maybe, maybe not.


There is another point I have to make though. This idea that having children is some sacred right. No one ever said that this drastic step would be easy or that it wouldn't be a major sacrifice for many people. Sorry, but surprise everybody, saving the planet isn't a walk in the park. Also, you'll notice that the only thing I've endorsed is VOLUNTEER sterilization. If you simply MUST have a child, go ahead, but do us all a favor and don't have 9 of them. You see, somebody, somewhere has to take responsibility for the future. What kind of life do you want your grandchild to have?

At any rate, I actually agree with both sides of this argument, and sometimes feel the way Ace feels: we're fucked, might as well enjoy what I can.
On the other hand, I sure would like my little boy to grow up to a planet that isn't an overcrowded dirtball where every day is a fight just to get bread and water. Undecided
[Image: Evolution.png]

Reply



Messages In This Thread
The Need to Breed - by Cinjin - August 12, 2012 at 10:11 pm
RE: The Need to Breed - by Rayaan - August 12, 2012 at 11:59 pm
RE: The Need to Breed - by Epimethean - August 13, 2012 at 12:48 am
RE: The Need to Breed - by The Grand Nudger - August 13, 2012 at 12:51 am
RE: The Need to Breed - by Angrboda - August 13, 2012 at 1:12 am
RE: The Need to Breed - by padraic - August 13, 2012 at 1:24 am
RE: The Need to Breed - by Minimalist - August 13, 2012 at 1:32 am
RE: The Need to Breed - by padraic - August 13, 2012 at 1:56 am
RE: The Need to Breed - by Minimalist - August 13, 2012 at 2:40 am
RE: The Need to Breed - by padraic - August 13, 2012 at 5:35 am
RE: The Need to Breed - by Minimalist - August 13, 2012 at 12:38 pm
RE: The Need to Breed - by Ace Otana - August 13, 2012 at 3:22 am
RE: The Need to Breed - by Ryantology - August 13, 2012 at 4:01 am
RE: The Need to Breed - by Cinjin - August 13, 2012 at 12:25 pm
RE: The Need to Breed - by Ace Otana - August 13, 2012 at 2:17 pm
RE: The Need to Breed - by Ryantology - August 13, 2012 at 6:21 pm
RE: The Need to Breed - by Rayaan - August 13, 2012 at 5:33 am
RE: The Need to Breed - by Cinjin - August 13, 2012 at 1:08 pm
RE: The Need to Breed - by Minimalist - August 13, 2012 at 2:15 pm
RE: The Need to Breed - by The Grand Nudger - August 13, 2012 at 6:01 pm
RE: The Need to Breed - by Cinjin - August 13, 2012 at 7:23 pm
RE: The Need to Breed - by Cato - August 14, 2012 at 12:20 am
RE: The Need to Breed - by Ryantology - August 14, 2012 at 12:43 am
RE: The Need to Breed - by Ace Otana - August 14, 2012 at 4:39 am
RE: The Need to Breed - by padraic - August 13, 2012 at 7:51 pm
RE: The Need to Breed - by Cinjin - August 13, 2012 at 8:00 pm
RE: The Need to Breed - by Epimethean - August 13, 2012 at 9:50 pm
RE: The Need to Breed - by Cinjin - August 13, 2012 at 10:34 pm
RE: The Need to Breed - by padraic - August 13, 2012 at 10:30 pm
RE: The Need to Breed - by Epimethean - August 13, 2012 at 11:42 pm
RE: The Need to Breed - by The Grand Nudger - August 13, 2012 at 11:58 pm
RE: The Need to Breed - by Cinjin - August 14, 2012 at 12:36 am
RE: The Need to Breed - by Minimalist - August 14, 2012 at 12:33 am
RE: The Need to Breed - by cratehorus - August 14, 2012 at 12:51 am
RE: The Need to Breed - by Cinjin - August 14, 2012 at 1:03 am
RE: The Need to Breed - by cratehorus - August 14, 2012 at 1:13 am
RE: The Need to Breed - by Cinjin - August 14, 2012 at 1:19 am
RE: The Need to Breed - by cratehorus - August 14, 2012 at 1:36 am
RE: The Need to Breed - by Cinjin - August 14, 2012 at 1:44 am
RE: The Need to Breed - by cratehorus - August 14, 2012 at 1:49 am
RE: The Need to Breed - by Cinjin - August 14, 2012 at 1:57 am
RE: The Need to Breed - by Jackalope - August 14, 2012 at 1:17 am
RE: The Need to Breed - by Rayaan - August 14, 2012 at 1:29 am
RE: The Need to Breed - by Shell B - August 14, 2012 at 2:06 am
RE: The Need to Breed - by cratehorus - August 14, 2012 at 2:08 am
RE: The Need to Breed - by Shell B - August 14, 2012 at 2:18 am
RE: The Need to Breed - by Cinjin - August 14, 2012 at 2:35 am
RE: The Need to Breed - by cratehorus - August 14, 2012 at 2:36 am
RE: The Need to Breed - by Cinjin - August 14, 2012 at 2:42 am
RE: The Need to Breed - by Shell B - August 14, 2012 at 3:11 am
RE: The Need to Breed - by cratehorus - August 14, 2012 at 3:52 am
RE: The Need to Breed - by Mister Agenda - August 15, 2012 at 11:47 am
RE: The Need to Breed - by Cinjin - August 15, 2012 at 12:00 pm
RE: The Need to Breed - by Mister Agenda - August 15, 2012 at 4:43 pm
RE: The Need to Breed - by Cinjin - August 16, 2012 at 10:42 am
RE: The Need to Breed - by Ace Otana - August 16, 2012 at 11:19 am
RE: The Need to Breed - by cratehorus - August 18, 2012 at 1:11 am
RE: The Need to Breed - by Cinjin - August 18, 2012 at 11:52 am
RE: The Need to Breed - by Angrboda - August 14, 2012 at 2:46 am
RE: The Need to Breed - by Cinjin - August 14, 2012 at 2:50 am
RE: The Need to Breed - by cratehorus - August 14, 2012 at 2:58 am
RE: The Need to Breed - by Angrboda - August 14, 2012 at 4:16 am
RE: The Need to Breed - by Shell B - August 14, 2012 at 12:53 pm
RE: The Need to Breed - by pgrimes15 - August 14, 2012 at 6:27 am
RE: The Need to Breed - by Tiberius - August 14, 2012 at 7:26 am
RE: The Need to Breed - by Cinjin - August 14, 2012 at 8:42 am
RE: The Need to Breed - by pgrimes15 - August 14, 2012 at 9:17 am
RE: The Need to Breed - by Minimalist - August 14, 2012 at 7:40 pm
RE: The Need to Breed - by Tiberius - August 14, 2012 at 7:58 pm
RE: The Need to Breed - by Epimethean - August 14, 2012 at 8:40 am
RE: The Need to Breed - by The Grand Nudger - August 14, 2012 at 9:35 am
RE: The Need to Breed - by Cinjin - August 14, 2012 at 10:32 am
RE: The Need to Breed - by Epimethean - August 14, 2012 at 9:54 am
RE: The Need to Breed - by The Grand Nudger - August 14, 2012 at 10:44 am
RE: The Need to Breed - by Cinjin - August 14, 2012 at 11:19 am
RE: The Need to Breed - by jackman - August 14, 2012 at 10:47 am
RE: The Need to Breed - by The Grand Nudger - August 14, 2012 at 11:52 am
RE: The Need to Breed - by Cinjin - August 14, 2012 at 2:45 pm
RE: The Need to Breed - by Violet - August 14, 2012 at 3:54 pm
RE: The Need to Breed - by Ben Davis - August 14, 2012 at 4:38 pm
RE: The Need to Breed - by Angrboda - August 14, 2012 at 6:49 pm
RE: The Need to Breed - by Shell B - August 14, 2012 at 7:49 pm
RE: The Need to Breed - by Minimalist - August 14, 2012 at 8:06 pm
RE: The Need to Breed - by Shell B - August 14, 2012 at 9:28 pm
RE: The Need to Breed - by Violet - August 14, 2012 at 9:54 pm
RE: The Need to Breed - by Cinjin - August 14, 2012 at 10:04 pm
RE: The Need to Breed - by Violet - August 14, 2012 at 11:52 pm
RE: The Need to Breed - by Cinjin - August 15, 2012 at 12:17 am
RE: The Need to Breed - by Tiberius - August 15, 2012 at 1:22 pm
RE: The Need to Breed - by downbeatplumb - August 15, 2012 at 1:32 pm
RE: The Need to Breed - by Cinjin - August 14, 2012 at 9:47 pm
RE: The Need to Breed - by The Grand Nudger - August 14, 2012 at 9:59 pm
RE: The Need to Breed - by Angrboda - August 14, 2012 at 10:52 pm
RE: The Need to Breed - by padraic - August 14, 2012 at 10:10 pm
RE: The Need to Breed - by Cinjin - August 14, 2012 at 10:13 pm
RE: The Need to Breed - by padraic - August 14, 2012 at 10:18 pm
RE: The Need to Breed - by The Grand Nudger - August 14, 2012 at 10:22 pm
RE: The Need to Breed - by Epimethean - August 14, 2012 at 10:42 pm
RE: The Need to Breed - by The Grand Nudger - August 14, 2012 at 10:51 pm
RE: The Need to Breed - by Epimethean - August 14, 2012 at 10:54 pm
RE: The Need to Breed - by The Grand Nudger - August 14, 2012 at 11:04 pm
RE: The Need to Breed - by Angrboda - August 14, 2012 at 11:26 pm
RE: The Need to Breed - by Epimethean - August 14, 2012 at 11:08 pm
RE: The Need to Breed - by Shell B - August 14, 2012 at 11:18 pm
RE: The Need to Breed - by The Grand Nudger - August 14, 2012 at 11:22 pm
RE: The Need to Breed - by Shell B - August 14, 2012 at 11:35 pm
RE: The Need to Breed - by Epimethean - August 14, 2012 at 11:29 pm
RE: The Need to Breed - by The Grand Nudger - August 14, 2012 at 11:39 pm
RE: The Need to Breed - by Angrboda - August 15, 2012 at 12:06 am
RE: The Need to Breed - by Reforged - August 14, 2012 at 11:43 pm
RE: The Need to Breed - by The Grand Nudger - August 14, 2012 at 11:48 pm
RE: The Need to Breed - by Shell B - August 15, 2012 at 12:31 am
RE: The Need to Breed - by Epimethean - August 14, 2012 at 11:52 pm
RE: The Need to Breed - by The Grand Nudger - August 15, 2012 at 12:01 am
RE: The Need to Breed - by Epimethean - August 15, 2012 at 12:07 am
RE: The Need to Breed - by Violet - August 15, 2012 at 12:20 am
RE: The Need to Breed - by The Grand Nudger - August 15, 2012 at 12:23 am
RE: The Need to Breed - by Epimethean - August 15, 2012 at 12:33 am
RE: The Need to Breed - by The Grand Nudger - August 15, 2012 at 12:53 am
RE: The Need to Breed - by Cinjin - August 15, 2012 at 12:54 am
RE: The Need to Breed - by Shell B - August 15, 2012 at 12:57 am
RE: The Need to Breed - by The Grand Nudger - August 15, 2012 at 1:08 am
RE: The Need to Breed - by Cinjin - August 15, 2012 at 1:15 am
RE: The Need to Breed - by Ace Otana - August 15, 2012 at 9:10 am
RE: The Need to Breed - by The Grand Nudger - August 15, 2012 at 1:17 am
RE: The Need to Breed - by MountOlympus - August 15, 2012 at 12:07 pm
RE: The Need to Breed - by Shell B - August 15, 2012 at 1:27 pm
RE: The Need to Breed - by Autumnlicious - August 15, 2012 at 1:41 pm
RE: The Need to Breed - by Shell B - August 15, 2012 at 1:46 pm
RE: The Need to Breed - by MountOlympus - August 15, 2012 at 2:00 pm
RE: The Need to Breed - by Autumnlicious - August 15, 2012 at 2:05 pm
RE: The Need to Breed - by MountOlympus - August 15, 2012 at 3:05 pm
RE: The Need to Breed - by Cinjin - August 15, 2012 at 3:17 pm
RE: The Need to Breed - by Rayaan - August 15, 2012 at 6:59 pm
RE: The Need to Breed - by Cinjin - August 19, 2012 at 11:01 pm
RE: The Need to Breed - by The Grand Nudger - August 19, 2012 at 11:58 pm
RE: The Need to Breed - by Cinjin - August 20, 2012 at 12:32 am
RE: The Need to Breed - by Mister Agenda - August 16, 2012 at 10:40 am
RE: The Need to Breed - by Mister Agenda - August 16, 2012 at 11:04 am
RE: The Need to Breed - by Reforged - August 17, 2012 at 11:50 pm
RE: The Need to Breed - by The Grand Nudger - August 18, 2012 at 4:30 pm
RE: The Need to Breed - by Shell B - August 18, 2012 at 9:35 pm
RE: The Need to Breed - by cratehorus - August 18, 2012 at 11:06 pm
RE: The Need to Breed - by Shell B - August 18, 2012 at 11:35 pm
RE: The Need to Breed - by Ace Otana - August 19, 2012 at 9:02 am
RE: The Need to Breed - by The Grand Nudger - August 19, 2012 at 10:42 am
RE: The Need to Breed - by Shell B - August 19, 2012 at 1:11 pm
RE: The Need to Breed - by The Grand Nudger - August 19, 2012 at 1:31 pm
RE: The Need to Breed - by Shell B - August 19, 2012 at 1:41 pm
RE: The Need to Breed - by The Grand Nudger - August 19, 2012 at 1:50 pm
RE: The Need to Breed - by Shell B - August 19, 2012 at 1:56 pm
RE: The Need to Breed - by Jackalope - August 19, 2012 at 2:09 pm
RE: The Need to Breed - by The Grand Nudger - August 19, 2012 at 2:07 pm
RE: The Need to Breed - by The Grand Nudger - August 19, 2012 at 2:12 pm
RE: The Need to Breed - by Shell B - August 19, 2012 at 2:32 pm
RE: The Need to Breed - by Jackalope - August 19, 2012 at 2:33 pm
RE: The Need to Breed - by The Grand Nudger - August 19, 2012 at 2:33 pm
RE: The Need to Breed - by The Grand Nudger - August 19, 2012 at 2:46 pm
RE: The Need to Breed - by Shell B - August 19, 2012 at 4:39 pm
RE: The Need to Breed - by The Grand Nudger - August 20, 2012 at 12:40 am
RE: The Need to Breed - by Cinjin - August 20, 2012 at 12:53 am
RE: The Need to Breed - by The Grand Nudger - August 20, 2012 at 1:10 am
RE: The Need to Breed - by Cinjin - August 20, 2012 at 1:40 am
RE: The Need to Breed - by cratehorus - August 20, 2012 at 2:00 am
RE: The Need to Breed - by cratehorus - August 20, 2012 at 1:22 am
RE: The Need to Breed - by The Grand Nudger - August 20, 2012 at 1:49 am
RE: The Need to Breed - by Cinjin - August 20, 2012 at 2:15 am
RE: The Need to Breed - by The Grand Nudger - August 20, 2012 at 2:03 am
RE: The Need to Breed - by The Grand Nudger - August 20, 2012 at 2:27 am
RE: The Need to Breed - by Cinjin - August 20, 2012 at 2:50 am
RE: The Need to Breed - by The Grand Nudger - August 20, 2012 at 8:46 am
RE: The Need to Breed - by Cinjin - August 28, 2012 at 9:41 pm
RE: The Need to Breed - by cratehorus - August 29, 2012 at 5:30 am
RE: The Need to Breed - by kılıç_mehmet - August 29, 2012 at 3:24 am
RE: The Need to Breed - by Cinjin - August 29, 2012 at 9:16 am
RE: The Need to Breed - by cratehorus - August 30, 2012 at 1:08 am
RE: The Need to Breed - by The Grand Nudger - August 29, 2012 at 4:23 pm
RE: The Need to Breed - by The Grand Nudger - August 29, 2012 at 6:34 pm
RE: The Need to Breed - by ib.me.ub - August 30, 2012 at 2:43 am
RE: The Need to Breed - by The Grand Nudger - September 3, 2012 at 1:50 pm
RE: The Need to Breed - by Ace Otana - September 5, 2012 at 7:43 am
RE: The Need to Breed - by frankiej - September 5, 2012 at 7:54 am
RE: The Need to Breed - by Ace Otana - September 5, 2012 at 8:01 am



Users browsing this thread: 1 Guest(s)