Angel of Jesus - horrific murder

[Norfolk And Chance]

Have a read of this story about the mentally ill Bulgarian man who brutally beheaded a woman in Tenerife.

http://www.huffingtonpost.co.uk/2013/02/...d%3D155588

Horrific, obvious case of mental illness.

But it's got me thinking...how can we tell the difference between schizophrenia, and the belief in spirit voices, revelations etc - both happen exclusively within the walls of a person's skull.

For me anyone that says "God spoke to me, he revealed himself" is simply mentally ill.

Note, just because you didn't commit horrific murder based on the imaginary voices in your head, doesn't make those voices real.

[Annik]

For me anyone that says "God spoke to me, he revealed himself" is simply mentally ill.

This is just reductionism.

This just goes to show how important it is that we care for our mentally ill. The sad thing is that many schizophrenic people end up on the streets (by choice) because they don't think anyone will help them and they find those that try to be suspicious. ):

[Norfolk And Chance]

This is just reductionism.

Not if you don't believe in the supernatural it isn't.

Think about it.

It can only be believed to be mental illness if you don't believe in the supernatural.

[Annik]

This is just reductionism.

Not if you don't believe in the supernatural it isn't.

Think about it.

It can only be believed to be mental illness if you don't believe in the supernatural.

No, it's reductionist. The question of the role of "hearing" or "perceiving" voices does not merit the simple answer of "them must be mentally ill" and evidence doesn't support that (on the whole). Reductionism has nothing to do with one's belief. It's boiling something down to an answer that is too simple to explain the phenomenon. Another example of this would be stating that all religion is just superstition (which simply isn't true).

[Mystical]

As far as I know, I'm the only athiest in my family. Do I think my family is mentally ill? Question: aren't we all to an extent?

My dad, he's definitely mentally ill and religion is the crux of his entire persona. Every action he does, is based on his beliefs. His father before him had schizophrenia and killed himself and his wife, as a result. So now my father has taken on a different path: the god path. Suicide is not allowed but every year he becomes more and more secluded, every time I talk to him he's more extreme. He fears a worldwide muslim takeover. Any attempts I make at getting him to a doctor for his diabetes is met with "doctors are just playing god" scenario.

If you strip away god from the equation, I guarantee you'd see a paranoid schitzo in the making. But no one can see, it's hidden behind a cloud of belief. Sometimes reduction-ism is necessary to see the forest through the trees.

[Annik]

As far as I know, I'm the only athiest in my family. Do I think my family is mentally ill? Question: aren't we all to an extent?

My dad, he's definitely mentally ill and religion is the crux of his entire persona. Every action he does, is based on his beliefs. His father before him had schizophrenia and killed himself and his wife, as a result. So now my father has taken on a different path: the god path. Suicide is not allowed but every year he becomes more and more secluded, every time I talk to him he's more extreme. He fears a worldwide muslim takeover. Any attempts I make at getting him to a doctor for his diabetes is met with "doctors are just playing god" scenario.

If you strip away god from the equation, I guarantee you'd see a paranoid schitzo in the making. But no one can see, it's hidden behind a cloud of belief. Sometimes reduction-ism is necessary to see the forest through the trees.

I just minor in psych and I'm defiantly not knowledgeable enough to make diagnoses of any sort, but I think you're doing the right thing by trying to get him in to see someone. Keep trying.

[Norfolk And Chance]

So yeah, theists are mental.

[Ben Davis]

Sarah, one of the daughters, is an aquaintance of mine but we get on pretty well. When she first talked to me about it, I had no idea how to respond other than with platitudes. The horrorific brutality, suddeness & nonsensicality of the attack made it seem unreal to me; almost impossible. In the end, I said very little but just let her talk, it seemed like that was really all she wanted. Even though the trail has been a long time coming, Sarah's managed to keep it together really well. I'm not sure I could show such strength.

To the OP, I understand that the main difference is the reification of the other voice; if you recognise it as an aspect of your own cognitive process, there's no problem however if you disassociate yourself from the other voice(s) by creating a personality(ies) for it(them), there's something wrong. I also think we know little more than 'sometimes the causes are psychological, sometimes neurological'. The likely response during incarceration will be to pump him full of drugs for 20-odd years than release him into care. I hope, in that time, doctors are able to learn from him; if we can know enough to prevent some future incidences, the current flawed systems won't have been completely useless.

[Mystical]

I would love to agree with you, that theists are mental. But most of them are not, despite believing in a higher power. Most people just live life, and it's not mental to make your choices based your own version of morality. It is mental, however, to say that god told you so or to claim to speak for god. And it's mental to impose your morality on someone else.
My point was that theism contributes to mental illness and not in a good way. Could you look into your sane aunt's eyes and say that she's mental for believing in god? Would you?