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Christians forgive themselves
November 2, 2013 at 10:01 am
One common theme I've noticed while living amongst christians in the bible belt is that christians forgive themselves over their own actions without ever involving the injured party. Apologies to another person are difficult, but getting absolution from jesus is easy and settles the christian mind.
How can they claim this is not immoral?
How can they not even notice it when they do this?
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RE: Christians forgive themselves
November 2, 2013 at 10:16 am
(November 2, 2013 at 10:01 am)Brakeman Wrote: One common theme I've noticed while living amongst christians in the bible belt is that christians forgive themselves over their own actions without ever involving the injured party. Apologies to another person are difficult, but getting absolution from jesus is easy and settles the christian mind.
How can they claim this is not immoral?
How can they not even notice it when they do this?
Everyone belongs to god.
If I damage another human I'm damaging one of god's things.
If I've sorted things out with god I don't see how god's thing has any business making any further claims on my concern.
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RE: Christians forgive themselves
November 2, 2013 at 11:52 am
Shit...I've 'slighted' christians who then have proceeded to tell me "It isn't me you need to forgive", or similar.(Implying it's myself, or the invisible man...) It kinda makes me ok with being a turd in their punchbowl. I can easily forgive myself for that.
Cultic practices dealing with considering themselves unworthy, I suppose...
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RE: Christians forgive themselves
November 2, 2013 at 12:16 pm
Substitutionary atonement is a ridiculous and immoral doctrine.
There only real atonement is between the person that has been wronged and person that wronged them.
Just another in the long line of examples of how Christianity forces people to surrender their morality.
You'd believe if you just opened your heart" is a terrible argument for religion. It's basically saying, "If you bias yourself enough, you can convince yourself that this is true." If religion were true, people wouldn't need faith to believe it -- it would be supported by good evidence.
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RE: Christians forgive themselves
November 2, 2013 at 12:21 pm
Jesus the great scape goat
To-morrow, and to-morrow, and to-morrow,
Creeps in this petty pace from day to day,
To the last syllable of recorded time;
And all our yesterdays have lighted fools
The way to dusty death. Out, out, brief candle!
Life's but a walking shadow, a poor player,
That struts and frets his hour upon the stage,
And then is heard no more. It is a tale
Told by an idiot, full of sound and fury,
Signifying nothing.
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RE: Christians forgive themselves
November 2, 2013 at 1:05 pm
Quote:If I owe Smith ten dollars and God forgives me, that doesn't pay Smith.
Robert G. Ingersoll
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RE: Christians forgive themselves
November 2, 2013 at 2:28 pm
Christians are very adept at creating ways to forgive themselves. If you look at the traditional structures of the big churches (the catholic church especially) you'll see lots of bolt-on mechanisms for excusing all sorts of crap. One curious setup which i'm sure everyone is familiar with entails visiting your local catholic church and confessing to some bloke in a wooden box, and by the grace of god you'll be forgiven for your sins (whatever they may be). The fact that this process is composed entirely of human faecal matter is self-evident. None of these hierarchical confession mechanisms are explicitly detailed in the bible, and as noted many times before, if god sees and knows everything then he can forgive you directly rather than through some child molester in a wooden box, even though he (god) knows the future and knew you were going to sin when he designed you, which would mean christianity makes no sense whatsoever.
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RE: Christians forgive themselves
November 2, 2013 at 3:11 pm
(November 2, 2013 at 12:16 pm)Simon Moon Wrote: Substitutionary atonement is a ridiculous and immoral doctrine.
There only real atonement is between the person that has been wronged and person that wronged them.
Just another in the long line of examples of how Christianity forces people to surrender their morality.
Your lack of understanding of Christianity is astounding, especially when you try to define it.
GC
God loves those who believe and those who do not and the same goes for me, you have no choice in this matter. That puts the matter of total free will to rest.
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RE: Christians forgive themselves
November 2, 2013 at 3:20 pm
(This post was last modified: November 2, 2013 at 3:20 pm by Mystical.)
lol GC, then by all means: expound for us just what he misunderstands then.
If I were to create self aware beings knowing fully what they would do in their lifetimes, I sure wouldn't create a HELL for the majority of them to live in infinitely! That's not Love, that's sadistic. Therefore a truly loving god does not exist!
Quote:The sin is against an infinite being (God) unforgiven infinitely, therefore the punishment is infinite.
Dead wrong. The actions of a finite being measured against an infinite one are infinitesimal and therefore merit infinitesimal punishment.
Quote:Some people deserve hell.
I say again: No exceptions. Punishment should be equal to the crime, not in excess of it. As soon as the punishment is greater than the crime, the punisher is in the wrong.
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RE: Christians forgive themselves
November 2, 2013 at 3:21 pm
(November 2, 2013 at 3:11 pm)Godschild Wrote: (November 2, 2013 at 12:16 pm)Simon Moon Wrote: Substitutionary atonement is a ridiculous and immoral doctrine.
There only real atonement is between the person that has been wronged and person that wronged them.
Just another in the long line of examples of how Christianity forces people to surrender their morality.
Your lack of understanding of Christianity is astounding, especially when you try to define it.
GC
@GC,
I gave Simon Moon kudos for his response because he has pointed out some very valid things. I agree almost completely with the first of the two points you've quoted above, however, I would slightly amend the last one by suggesting that this is one of the ways in which Christianity causes people to surrender their humanity. Morality may or may not be a moot issue in the matter of forgiveness.
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