Insatiable Flirt

[c172]

Drat. I missed being reply #69.

[freedomfromforum]

Drat. I missed being reply #69.

Mine was 69

[Rayaan]

Wow, you have a pretty selfish view of flirting.

I thought that only corresponded with your own statement, when you said that flirting should always be about fun and ego boost, never about catching someone:

[...] is a shame because flirting should always be this:

Flirting is harmless fun and a great ego boost, I think.

But selfishness was not really my issue. Afterall, almost everything that we do can be called "selfish" in some respect, and you acknowledged that as well. I think that we are inherently selfish creatures, and you might agree with that also. Rather, I was mainly debating the nature and the method of such an ego boost that people get from flirting irrespective of whether they are being selfish or not. Of course the ego boost is selfish.

I don't know, but I also think it is pretty ironic that sometimes you tell members to "fuck what other people might think," but over here you eloquently composed how great it feels just to know that this one particular person admires you and how he makes you feel as if the stars and the whole world has begun to revolve around you ... lol.

Because it has nothing to do with making my confidence better.

So per that statement, flirting has absolutely nothing to do with making your confidence better.

But earlier, you wrote that flirting should always be about ... what? Ego boost.

Nice contradiction you made there.


What is more contradictory is that, after that sentence, you wrote that flirting has everything to do with the making the other person see who they are.

Bolding mine:

It has everything to do with confidently making that person see, just for a moment, themselves reflected in my eyes. They experience for a brief time their self that I know and care about. No longer is that man (or woman) over-worked, graying, tired, and dull. He sees himself again - interesting, worth-knowing, invigorated, attractive, and exciting.

So, initially, you said that flirting should always be about fun and ego boost.
Later, you change gears by saying that flirting has nothing to do with increasing your confidence.
And, finally, you turn it all the way around, i.e. by saying that it's all about making the other person feel important/special.

You made a nice, long post, but apparently your arguments are all over the place.

[Rayaan]

Does doing something well that you are skilled at give you a boost?

Yes - more or less.

Is that boost real, or 'forced' and 'artificial'?

No, it's real.

But if my level of confidence was in so much in need of recognition from other people, especially from a single person, and then trying to get their attention such as by flirting, then the boost is not as real as I would like to think.

It would be more of an illusory boost because it implies that I am willing to assess myself mostly through someone else's mind and less through my own.

[thesummerqueen]

I thought that only corresponded with your own statement, when you said that flirting should always be about fun and ego boost, never about catching someone:

I don't think flirting should be. Flirting is a lot of fun, and shouldn't be used ONLY because you want to be with someone, anyone, or someone in particular.

Rather, I was mainly debating the nature and the method of such an ego boost that people get from flirting irrespective of whether they are being selfish or not. Of course the ego boost is selfish.

Right, you don't think people should use flirting to create a connection between the two of them that makes people feel good, because you think it's shallow and illusory. I think I stated why it wasn't - it's temporary, but it's not illusory.

I don't know, but I also think it is pretty ironic that sometimes you tell members to "fuck what other people might think," but over here you eloquently composed how great it feels just to know that this one particular person admires you and how he makes you feel as if the stars and the whole world has begun to revolve around you ... lol.

No one needs negativity and judgment. Everyone likes a little kick in their step. I don't have to actually care what some dude thinks about me to still smile if he pays me a compliment.

So per that statement, flirting has absolutely nothing to do with making your confidence better.

But earlier, you wrote that flirting should always be about ... what? Ego boost.

Okay - maybe so - I'm confident already, and the boost isn't 'fixing' anything so maybe I don't always equate the two. I'm not really understanding why you have a problem with the idea of it being a boost to either person.

So, initially, you said that flirting should always be about fun and ego boost.
Later, you change gears by saying that flirting has nothing to do with increasing your confidence.
And, finally, you turn it all the way around, i.e. by saying that it's all about making the other person feel important/special.

Ah, okay - you seemed to suggest when you first wrote in that it was about MY ego boost, hence the reason I said it's not really about mine - it's about that other person. I don't flirt with people whose egos I don't want to boost and 99% of the time I don't need it myself.

I think part of people being kinder to each other is learning to compliment each other and remind others where their strengths are and that we appreciate them for who and what they do. I try to do this to my friends when the chance arises, some of which involves flirting, and there are a lot of people who are so unused to receiving compliments or being appreciated in any form that to receive them indicates interest on the part of the giver. I think that's sad. I don't think flirting or compliment giving should be reserved only for when you want to complete a conquest of a person or start a serious relationship with them - I think everyone should do it more often. That's not to say everyone would be comfortable with it, of course. It's just what I would like to have happen.

You gave three reasons why someone would flirt...except there are more reasons than those. You're taking a very narrow view of it. And you also shut the ego part of it into a narrow, selfish box. "Forced" - you called it. In what way is it "forced?" Why wouldn't I want to flirt if my self-esteem wasn't up to par? Rather - it seems like people with lower self-esteem are the ones who DON'T flirt. You have to have confidence to make someone believe the truth you see about them. Otherwise, it doesn't work.

[freedomfromforum]

But if my level of confidence was in so much in need of recognition from other people, especially from a single person, and then trying to get their attention such as by flirting, then the boost is not as real as I would like to think.

It would be more of an illusory boost because it implies that I am willing to assess myself mostly through someone else's mind and less through my own.

I merely stated that observing oneself performing well in a preferred venue provides a genuine boost.

I'm good at many things, and observing myself performing well in those areas gives me a REAL boost of self-confidence, because it demonstrates that I have good reason to be confident in myself.

(emphasis added)

If I tune my car, and it runs flawlessly because I am a skilled technician, would I be using someone else to boost my ego simply because they may be impressed by my skills, or would I get a REAL boost from taking delight in reaping the joy of my skill and labor.

The distinction may be a subjective one. I never insinuated that I assess my skill level by the recognition of others. I said that I assess them from my own observation. I provide my own feedback based very loosely on the responsiveness of others.

[Owlix]

... flirting is fun and if it leads to more, I am such a person as might welcome what may come.
I guess maybe that's how I've met some of the people I have, unintentional flirtation.

[Rayaan]

Okay - maybe so - I'm confident already, and the boost isn't 'fixing' anything so maybe I don't always equate the two.

- But in a different post, you admitted that you admire confidence because you lack it.
- In another post, you admitted that one man completely devastated your confidence and then it took five other guys to "fix" it.
- Elsewhere, you wrote that you don't have a general lot of confidence in yourself ...

And, in this thread, you're telling me that you never flirt for your own confidence/ego boost as if you have no need for that at all. "I'm confident already."


Try harder not to contradict yourself, please.

Ah, okay - you seemed to suggest when you first wrote in that it was about MY ego boost, hence the reason I said it's not really about mine - it's about that other person.

So ... if it's not about increasing your ego, at all ... then why did you write all this stuff about feeling so important and all:

There's a certain something about romance where the person who is romancing you makes you feel like the stars - for a time - revolve around you. You feel important. You might already know you're important to any number of people, but this one particular person (or many - it can be more than one at a time) turns the world into a smorgasbord of sensation, and you're at the center of a whirlwind of excitement and nerves and happiness so bone-deep, you feel drenched in light. The world could be going to hell in a handbasket around you, and you would be there, incandescent and hopeful, because the delight suffuses you utterly.

None of the above applies to you? It's supposed to be everything for the other person now?

I don't flirt with people whose egos I don't want to boost and 99% of the time I don't need it myself.

Which would mean that the ego boost is almost never for yourself, right?

Yet again ... it's very clear that when Kay wrote that flirting is "harmless fun and a great ego boost," you knew that she was talking about the act of flirting as being both fun and an ego boost for herself, and then you responded to that by saying that ... it should be always about that (i.e. fun and ego boost). If those two things were more attributed to the other person than yourself (or herself), then you would have mentioned it, but you didn't, and the reason is clear. You went from "flirting should be for ego boost" to "flirting is more about ego boost for the other person." And now you've been trying to dance around the fact that you changed your argument.

But too bad you weren't subtle enough.

The distinction may be a subjective one. I never insinuated that I assess my skill level by the recognition of others. I said that I assess them from my own observation. I provide my own feedback based very loosely on the responsiveness of others.

You have a point.

But, in the the case of flirting, it seems like the ego boost comes to you more at the expense of flattering other people about who you are, because flirting itself is not really sincere. Oftentimes people try to hide their true feelings and their intentions by modifying themselves with beautiful make-up and clothes and whatever things they put on, and then they may try to act completely differently in front of other people ... accompanied by sweet words and compliments even though they may not sincerely mean it. I know all that BS. The whole flirting thing is theatrical.

The desire to be admired by flirting is more a sign of a poor ego. And the boost you get out of it is very shaky and transient, if not artificial.

[Angrboda]

But, in the the case of flirting, it seems like the ego boost comes to you more at the expense of flattering other people about who you are, because flirting itself is not really sincere. Oftentimes people try to hide their true feelings and their intentions by modifying themselves with beautiful make-up and clothes and whatever things they put on, and then they may try to act completely differently in front of other people ... accompanied by sweet words and compliments even though they may not sincerely mean it. I know all that BS. The whole flirting thing is theatrical.

Perhaps for you, but not for me. One of the thrills of flirting for me is the vulnerability. That sexual and emotional vulnerability normally comes in a committed relationship, but I get a temporary experience of it in flirting.

[freedomfromforum]

The desire to be admired by flirting is more a sign of a poor ego. And the boost you get out of it is very shaky and transient, if not artificial.

I agree that if you flirt to meet a desire to be admired that it is suggestive of lowered self-esteem. I flirt as a means of social exercise. As when I go to the gym; I keep up my strengths by exercising them regularly, and I sense a certain confidence in my ability to keep in shape. I run better when I'm in good physical shape. When I run better because I'm in good shape, I feel confident not only in my abilities, but also in my maintenance regimen. Flirting is no different for me in this regard. If, on the other hand, I am at the gym, or running, to impress others, and thereby get an ego boost, then that boost would indeed be at best, shaky, if not artificial.