Archaeological Report on Magen and Peleg's Dig at Qumran

[Minimalist]

So you can promptly declare them non-serious historians? I am well aware of the tricks employed by jesus freaks, Danny.

Start with Philip R. Davies, Thomas Thompson, Niels Peter Lemche and Keith Whitelam.
Their books are out there. Read. Learn.

Put down your silly bible and get with the program.

[Aractus]

There you go putting words in my mouth again. I didn't say "non-serious historian" anywhere. Opinions by non-historians, by UFO-believing crazies, etc, are not what I'm after. Anyway I'm well aware of what your argument is - however you didn't address the question. Whether they believe some of the Bible to be invented history is one thing, where's your sources that say that the First AND the Second Temples were invented?

[Minimalist]

I didn't say "non-serious historian" anywhere.

I know you didn't say it. I'm just predicting your reaction when...or if...you study the subject and find out that there is not a shred of evidence for your precious "Hebrews" prior to the Persian period.

You people are very predictable.

[Aractus]

Again, produce your evidence that the first and second temple are invented.

[Minimalist]

The first temple only. There probably was a second temple that Herod the Great replaced.

The evidence is archaeological. Jerusalem, in the 10th century BC was a miniscule little shithole of perhaps 1,000 people...or, it was even less than that.

If you want to read up on the evidence for that I suggest:

http://jesusneverexisted.com/solomon.htm

Supposedly, an Israelite empire flourished in the 10th century BC, during a time of temporary weakness of both Assyria and Egypt. Yet the fabled empire of David and Solomon remains just that: a fable, unsupported by any evidence – and empires normally leave a great deal of evidence. Archaeology is unequivocal: there was never the wealth, population, political cohesiveness, or literacy in the tiny settlement around Jerusalem to have ever dominated its more developed northern neighbors.

Oh, btw...about your marvelous "first temple."

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Ain_Dara_temple

There are many features in common with Solomon's Temple as described in the Book of Kings. The layout of Dara is similar to that of the Biblical temple, which was also of a long room plan with the three room configuration of a portico at the entrance followed by the main chamber with the shrine. The difference is in the antechamber, which is an add-on in the Ain Dara temple. The size of the Solomon temple was 120 feet (37 m) by 34 feet (10 m) while that of the Ain Dara is 98 feet (30 m) long by 65 feet (20 m) wide without side chambers. Other similarities include: location on a high raised site overlooking a city; erected on a raised platform, with a narrow portico and a roof supported on pillars flanked by reliefs on the walls, and carvings of similar motifs; and the raised podium. In brief, 33 of the architectural elements found in Ain Dara are tallied with 65 of the features mentioned in the Biblical description of Solomon's Temple.

It's in Syria...probably destroyed by the Assyrians...but when your boys got around to writing their nonsense out they had a fine model.

[dcamp67]

Ahh the ancient Jews, they were so dutiful in preserving the items touched and used DIRECTLY by their god. Tell me, if you "received" tablets (even replacements) or had a box that "housed" the glory of your tribes god, would you ever lose it? I think it would be handed down to the succeeding generations of believers with fanatical attention to it's preservation.

The Holy Temple was taken and destroyed, the contents plundered and destroyed on more than one occasion - this included the Temple Scrolls!

The Masoretic Text was preserved by using private copies that Rabbi's had. Once it had been written, it became the standard text - ie Rabbi's could view it to compare it to their copies and make corrections - just as had been the case with the ancient Temple Scrolls.

You didn't answer the questions. Predictable. If you want me to answer your questions and give then due thought, then I demand the same. Answer the questions or you prove yourself to be a proselytizing intellectual fraud posing as a reasoned debator.

[Minimalist]

We've known Danny longer than you have. That is pretty well established.

Still....he's not as bad as most of them.