RE: Agnosticism Vs. Atheism
December 17, 2009 at 11:24 pm
(December 17, 2009 at 10:57 pm)fr0d0 Wrote: Ray Comforts 'know' is very different to scientific 'know'.. and you know it!
*oh lord, give me strength*
Ok, so I can now deduce you have absolutely no idea what you are talking about in the first place. Huxley never said scientific knowledge, he never meant it. Agnosticism isn't related to science, it's a position of philosophy. It doesn't embrace empiricism anymore than it embraces spiritualism. It is a freakin' position on whether something can be known or not.
Jebus...moving on...
Quote:I have 'absolute knowledge' of my own belief. What you're continuously doing is superimposing 'evidence' where it's never invoked. Atheism isn't the disbelief in the existence of deities, just the lack of belief in deities. (c'mon I deserve a +1 for that! )
I would argue that nobody has absolute knowledge of anything, but I don't want to skew this discussion anymore off course than it already is.
Ok, some basic English class now fr0d0:
Disbelieve = To have no belief in.
Lack = To be without.
Lack of belief = To be without belief.
"To be without belief" vs "To have no belief in". To be honest, I don't see a fucking difference. Both statements imply the absence of belief, just with different words. You are now simply arguing semantics to a stupid level.
Quote:Perhaps I should change my religious views to "Militant Theist: I can't know and neither can you."
That would be a militant agnostic theist then. Theism is a belief in the existence of a deity. Like I've said before, it says nothing about your position on whether the existence can be known.
Theism: belief in the existence of a god or gods (dictionary.com)
The phrase I use at the end of my statement "I can't know and neither can you" is in reference to the agnostic part,
not the atheist part (since such a statement doesn't say anything about whether I believe or not). An agnostic theist could use the same statement just as easily, but it is in reference to agnosticism, not theism.
Quote:And isn't that the same as saying "I'm militant about not knowing"? What's wrong with the strength of that position?
Being militant about not knowing is a stupid position (as you pointed out last time). You can go around pushing on people that you "don't know", but what would be the point? You aren't exactly affecting anyone. Militant theism and atheism is the pushing of one state of mind over another, militant agnosticism is the pushing of the philosophy that such things simply cannot be known (no matter how hard some theists and atheists want it).
Quote:I did notice that you capitalize Agnostic and am prepared to grant you that.
If I did it was for a title or by mistake. In my religious views, I capitalize it because it's a title. Otherwise (unless it's at the beginning of a sentence) it should be lowercase, as with theism and atheism. In cases I have not done this, it was a typo.