Try and prove me wrong on this...

[Losty]

There is no portal.
There never will be a portal.
People like you make me so angry. I don't like to be angry. I like to be happy and gentle, kind and understanding. I try not to judge people because I know all too well that we all have our own personal issues and being normal isn't always easy. I have been through a lot, as most people have. I have PTSD and depression. I struggle with it every single day. I have to force myself to care. Some days are harder than others. If you feel this way, I am sorry. I know it hurts. Pull yourself together though. Fairytales aren't real, you have to get over that.
To say that someone else's life is more valuable than mine because I have depression is complete bullshit.
I'm sorry, I know this isn't very nice thing to say, but please grow up.

[Rhizomorph13]

Hmm, the OP reaks of guilt. Being selfish is the best way to be, but then from a place of power, one should help others. You have to become the best you then you can best help others. There is no simulacrum that will do it for you, nor is there a portal, unless you take enough bong rips...

Bottom line, helping others out of a feeling of duty usually fails to bring happiness, but I've received much happiness from helping others when it suited me. I do it a lot actually, but it was my choice.

I AM a parent. I knew when I got into it that my will would be subsumed into these little beings needs, and I made that choice from a place of power. I lived alone and single for years and it was bliss on tap by the gallons. Now, a little less bliss, but certainly fulfilling in a mature way.

[Mozart Link]

I don't see why being a parent can make one's arguments or opinion less valuable. Some people choose to not have kids

It doesn't. However, the OP strikes me as a miserably self-absorbed little shit who wouldn't cross the fucking street to help someone if it impeded his "happiness" while expecting others, especially family, to sacrifice endlessly on his/her behalf (see the ridiculous "I'd rather be retarded and cared for" spiel). I have neither time nor sympathy for such people, and I speak as one who had serious bouts of depression in the past. But no matter how I felt, I was never for a moment tempted to trade off my intelligence, as the OP would. I consider it a craven and contemptible attitude.

My remark was intended to point out that the OP doesn't seem at this time to have anyone or anything else to live for. He will most likely feel different about that in the future -- especially if there are children involved. If the OP never becomes a parent -- great. He will still need to find something strong enough to pull him out of his morbid self-absorption.

**I don't know the gender of the OP. I wrote "he" just to avoid the ugly and awkward he/she. If the OP is female, my apologies.**

I not only argued why my pleasure is more important from my own "selfish" perspective, but I have also argued this from another point of view (from a caring and selfless person's point of view such as yourself). That would, again, be that my family would obviously be more devastated knowing that I am intelligent and have no pleasure and that they would be happy and at peace knowing that I am retarded and am happy myself regardless of how hard it makes their lives in taking care of me and such.

So I ask here, why wouldn't they feel devastated if I were to be intelligent and such with no pleasure and why would they feel better knowing that I have no pleasure than if I were to be happy and them having to take care of me? They would obviously value my emotional well-being (pleasure) much more than the fact that they have the burden of having to take care of me and they would also value my pleasure over my intelligence and other things about me and such. Which is obviously why I would choose to be retarded and not cause my family the most devastation.

Therefore, from both my own "selfish" perspective and also from the "selfless" perspective of a helpful and caring person, my argument holds true for both of these types of people.

[Crossless2.0]

I don't know quite what to make of this. Personally, I wouldn't equate emotional well-being with pleasure. The former would include satisfaction, contentment, achievement of targets, the regard of others, and such things. Pleasure seems to be such a lonely thing, self-gratification mostly. Maybe you could summarise the difference by comparing making love with someone to masterbation.

As Cross says, small kindnesses are important, and so, for example, is the opportunity to help people in their careers, which I've been fortunate to be able to do.

Spread the love.

I think this is spot on. Perhaps the OP means pleasure in such a way that it includes satisfaction, the achievement of goals, etc. but that is not clear from the posts. Your distinction between making love and masturbating is apropos.

I encourage Mozart Link to step away from the anime long enough to read some Viktor Frankl. To paraphrase Frankl (who borrowed it from Nietzsche): A person can endure almost any "what" provided he has a "why." And Frankl was a Holocaust survivor -- a damned bit harder than watching videos, pulling on one's pecker, and moaning about a lack of "pleasure."

[Losty]

They wouldn't feel devastated because they would see you as an intelligent being. They would tell you if you want to be happy, then grow up and do something about it.

[Mudhammam]

I don't know quite what to make of this. Personally, I wouldn't equate emotional well-being with pleasure. The former would include satisfaction, contentment, achievement of targets, the regard of others, and such things. Pleasure seems to be such a lonely thing, self-gratification mostly. Maybe you could summarise the difference by comparing making love with someone to masterbation.

As Cross says, small kindnesses are important, and so, for example, is the opportunity to help people in their careers, which I've been fortunate to be able to do.

Spread the love.

"'Tis sweet, when, down the mighty main, the winds
Roll up its waste of waters, from the land
To watch another's labouring anguish far,
Not that we joyously delight that man
Should thus be smitten, but because 'tis sweet
To mark what evils we ourselves be spared;
'Tis sweet, again, to view the mighty strife
Of armies embattled yonder o'er the plains,
Ourselves no sharers in the peril; but naught
There is more goodly than to hold the high
Serene plateaus, well fortressed by the wise,
Whence thou may'st look below on other men
And see them ev'rywhere wand'ring, all dispersed
In their lone seeking for the road of life;
Rivals in genius, or emulous in rank,
Pressing through days and nights with hugest toil
For summits of power and mastery of the world.
O wretched minds of men! O blinded hearts!
In how great perils, in what darks of life
Are spent the human years, however brief!-
O not to see that Nature for herself
Barks after nothing, save that pain keep off,
Disjoined from the body, and that mind enjoy
Delightsome feeling, far from care and fear!
Therefore we see that our corporeal life
Needs little, altogether, and only such
As takes the pain away, and can besides
Strew underneath some number of delights."

Here Lucretius speaks about the pleasure that is derived from philosophy, from understanding Nature, including the actions of our fellow beings. I tend to think that pleasure in the hedonistic sense--at least as I associate it with selfishness and immediate gratification--is almost unworthy of the title in comparison to the pleasure that can be experienced through cooperation, the pursuit of knowledge, and the like.

[Crossless2.0]

I not only argued why my pleasure is more important from my own "selfish" perspective, but I have also argued this from another point of view (from a caring and selfless person's point of view such as yourself). That would, again, be that my family would obviously be more devastated knowing that I am intelligent and have no pleasure and that they would be happy and at peace knowing that I am retarded and am happy myself regardless of how hard it makes their lives in taking care of me and such.

So I ask here, why wouldn't they feel devastated if I were to be intelligent and such with no pleasure and why would they feel better knowing that I have no pleasure than if I were to be happy and them having to take care of me? They would obviously value my emotional well-being (pleasure) much more than the fact that they have the burden of having to take care of me and they would also value my pleasure over my intelligence and other things about me and such. Which is obviously why I would choose to be retarded and not cause my family the most devastation.

Therefore, from both my own "selfish" perspective and also from the "selfless" perspective of a helpful and caring person, my argument holds true for both of these types of people.

False dichotomy. Neither your parents nor anyone else you know or will know is utterly "selfless". And while I don't doubt for a moment that they would do their utmost to care for you if you could will yourself into a state of dependent, imbecilic "happiness", I also suspect that they would quietly resent your decision and wish that you had just got your shit together instead. Unless, of course, wiping your ass until the end of time is their thing. But I doubt it.

It's telling that in all of this you do not even seem to consider what your hypothetical decision would do to their plans for life and their happiness. It's all about you, isn't it? You don't seem nearly interesting enough to occupy center stage in this world.

[ShaMan]

There is no portal.
There never will be a portal.

<snip>...nor is there a portal...

I've suggested one. I was not being facetious when I said that peace of mind is a portal. I appreciate the wisdom of both of the full responses that I have quoted from, and I am not arguing. I am suggesting that dwelling on the 'crap' in life trains the mind to see only crap everywhere, even where beauty lies. One must train the mind to dwell on peaceful thoughts. Once properly trained, the mind will begin to see beauty not only where it lies, but also where the crap formerly held sway. Our minds can be changed, but we have to change them ourselves, willingly and actively.

[Mozart Link]

They wouldn't feel devastated because they would see you as an intelligent being. They would tell you if you want to be happy, then grow up and do something about it.

If my lack of ability to experience pleasure were permanent and there is no way I could do anything to make myself feel more pleasure in life, then they would feel devastated. Intelligence (thoughts and such) are nothing more than mere biological functions such as breathing, movement, etc. But pleasure is your emotional well-being here and is what makes your life worth living (as I argued in my opening post). So for them to feel happier knowing that I am reduced to nothing more than mere biological functions (which would, again, be intelligence and such with no pleasure) than if I were to be retarded and happy would make no sense.

[FatAndFaithless]

They wouldn't feel devastated because they would see you as an intelligent being. They would tell you if you want to be happy, then grow up and do something about it.

If my lack of ability to experience pleasure were permanent and there is no way I could do anything to make myself feel more pleasure in life, then they would feel devastated. Intelligence (thoughts and such) are nothing more than mere biological functions such as breathing, movement, etc. But pleasure is your emotional well-being here and is what makes your life worth living (as I argued in my opening post). So for them to feel happier knowing that I am reduced to nothing more than mere biological functions (which would, again, be intelligence and such with no pleasure) than if I were to be retarded and happy would make no sense.

Welp, you got more than just that one post to which to respond. Especially love the part about consciousness being "nothing more" than brain states and chemistry, while "pleasure" is somehow special.

Seriously man, the more you talk the more I think of
.