Heads up advice for atheists.

[Cato]

Brian,
I was extending Chad's reference to the Tower of Babel story by invoking a movie where a Voyager probe returned to destroy Earth. I was assuming that people would see the similarity to the Babel story in that the probe would reach even further towards God resulting in retribution.

You read this and proceded to 'not give sci fi woo a pass'.

My following comment was poking fun at your consistent ability to curmudgeonly find fault with anything not associated with ABBA.

[Brian37]

Brian,
I was extending Chad's reference to the Tower of Babel story by invoking a movie where a Voyager probe returned to destroy Earth. I was assuming that people would see the similarity to the Babel story in that the probe would reach even further towards God resulting in retribution.

You read this and proceded to 'not give sci fi woo a pass'.

My following comment was poking fun at your consistent ability to curmudgeonly find fault with anything not associated with ABBA.

Finding fault with ABBA is blasphemy worthy of a death sentence!

[Alex K]

Unfortunately even today si fi fans fall for that crap. NASA put out an article about the "warp drive". Si fi fans jumped all over it as proof it was a possibility missing the part of the article that reduced the concept as merely being on paper. The article also said to accomplish the "warp drive" it would take all the energy in the universe to accomplish.

Even worse, it needs a humongous localized *negative* energy density, something that does not obviously exist at all. Such energy configurations usually do allow time travel. So it's more than a big if, although the maths is appealing.

---

Finding fault with ABBA is blasphemy worthy of a death sentence!

Yeah? What are they gonna do? Blind me with some sort of super trooper lights?

[Brian37]

Unfortunately even today si fi fans fall for that crap. NASA put out an article about the "warp drive". Si fi fans jumped all over it as proof it was a possibility missing the part of the article that reduced the concept as merely being on paper. The article also said to accomplish the "warp drive" it would take all the energy in the universe to accomplish.

Even worse, it needs a humongous localized *negative* energy density, something that does not obviously exist at all. Such energy configurations usually do allow time travel. So it's more than a big if, although the maths is appealing.

---

Finding fault with ABBA is blasphemy worthy of a death sentence!

Yeah? What are they gonna do? Blind me with some sort of super trooper lights?

NOBODY PUTS ABBA IN THE CORNER!

[Ben Davis]

Well, I always wanted to test this verse against science (probably most Muslims wanted to) :

Okay, go!

( 33 ) O people from jinn and mankind,

Oh dear, we're off to a bad start here. References to supernatural creatures won't get you past any peer review process.

if you are able to pass beyond the regions of the heavens and the earth, then pass.

'Beyond' the heavens & earth? What does this even mean; outside of 2 universes? It should be clear by now that these are not scientific definitions.

You will not pass except by power (literal translation of the word سلطان).

...yeah, I'd imagine it might take quite a lot of energy to 'pass beyond' 2 universes...

( 34 ) So which of the favors of your Lord would you deny?

Woah there! Big jump. So the ability to 'pass beyond' 2 universes will piss allah off? How? Why? You need to show your working.

( 35 ) There will be sent upon you Fragments (the literal translation of شواظ) of fire & brass and you will not succeed.

Firstly, 'fragments of fire' is not scientifically possible. Fire is not an element (contrary to the beliefs at the time the qur'an was written), it's a facet of energy-release which accompanies a change of material state following the addition of sufficient amounts of energy. Secondly, since both fire & brass are aspects of our universe, how would anyone know if either of them exist once we 'pass beyond' not just our universe but that of 'heaven', too? Thirdly, given what we know of what's necessary to make interstellar space travel possible, why would you imagine that anyone who could 'pass beyond' 2 universes wouldn't have developed sheilding?

So for an ancient Muslim, he/she must be wondering : am I really really going to get hit by tiny hot fragments if I got into outer space without the proper power -the sultan literally means "ultimate power/authority + control over something"..

Well, they wouldn't have known what outer space was but otherwise plausible, I suppose...

Well we could've saved scientists some extra time by showing them this verse ; it would've guided them immediately to MICROMETEOROIDS !! with are actually fragments so hot (just like a mixture of fire & brass/copper) that kills you if you travel outer space without enough "sultan/power" !!!

What? You're not serious?! There's nothing in those verses that even comes close to describing micrometeoroids. They're certainly not composed of 'fire & brass'.

This is clearly an attempt to retro-fitting current knowledge in to an obviously vague reference in an attempt to make it look like bronze-aged mystics had even the foggiest idea what was really going on in the universe. Anything but scientific.

[fr0d0]

You'd make a good witch finder Brian. Your logic is just as valid

[Brian37]

You'd make a good witch finder Brian. Your logic is just as valid

Frodo, you know damned well after all this time that what I attack are claims not human rights. Witch hunts were done because of religion, superstition and delusion.

If you have no evidence, I will not burn you at the stake. I will simply voice the fact that you have no evidence.

[fr0d0]

You seem to have a 13 year misunderstanding that theists claim objective evidence of God. You think that scientific proof obtained in a lab has something to do with faith. Likewise witch trials determined proof of witchcraft the ability to swim. If you drowned you were obviously a witch. It's the logic you use which is the same. Luckily you're not also psychopathic.

[Cyberman]

Actually, if you drowned you were innocent.

[fr0d0]

You are correct. I said both were positive proof. Oops.