Our server costs ~$56 per month to run. Please consider donating or becoming a Patron to help keep the site running. Help us gain new members by following us on Twitter and liking our page on Facebook!
Current time: March 30, 2020, 2:50 pm

Thread Rating:
  • 0 Vote(s) - 0 Average
  • 1
  • 2
  • 3
  • 4
  • 5
Logical Absolutes
Logical Absolutes
Now that Arcanus is back, I can start a discussion on something I'd been meaning to ask him for quite a while; namely the existence of logical absolutes.

The three laws of logic forming the logical absolutes are:

1) Law of Identity: Something is what it is and isn't what it is not. (A = A)
2) Law of Non-Contradiction: Something cannot be both true and false at the same time in the same sense. ¬(A ^ ¬A)
3) Law of Excluded Middle: A statement is either true or false, without a middle ground. (P v ¬P)

The argument for these logical absolutes is that they all validate each other, and that without one, logic falls apart. Also, that if one of them is not true, you get logical contradictions. The example I'm used to is that if the Law of Non-Contradiction is false, then something can be both true and false at the same time and in the same sense, which means that the Law of Non-Contradiction is true (as well as false). But if the law of Non-Contradiction is true, then something cannot be both true and false at the same time, and so the law of Non-Contradiction cannot be both true and false at the same time, and so it must be true.

There are objections to this argument; namely that it uses the laws of logic in order to show that the laws of logic are valid and absolute.

So this thread is basically a discussion of the laws of logic, whether they are absolute, and whether they can be proved absolute. I haven't done much research on this area, but I've always found it intriguing, and Arcanus probably knows more about it that I do.
RE: Logical Absolutes
First, the laws of logic are not subject to a proof, by virtue of their being self-evident axioms; what that means is, their justification is instrinsic (they justify themselves), not extrinsic (something else justifies them). Second, that is also why they are absolute, or true in all places for all circumstances at all times; as you recognized, any arguments against the laws of logic cannot but use them.
Man is a rational animal who always loses his temper when
called upon to act in accordance with the dictates of reason.
(Oscar Wilde)
RE: Logical Absolutes
Truth. And a super-necro compounded by me.

[Image: 8mBnWdp.png]

Ryft and I disagreed on an awful lot but at least he understood this Big Grin
RE: Logical Absolutes
RE: Logical Absolutes
This is probably the worst necropost ever lol.
RE: Logical Absolutes
The only logical absolute is that there are no logical absolutes.
Even if the open windows of science at first make us shiver after the cozy indoor warmth of traditional humanizing myths, in the end the fresh air brings vigor, and the great spaces have a splendor of their own - Bertrand Russell
RE: Logical Absolutes
RE: Logical Absolutes
(November 19, 2016 at 8:33 pm)Tiberius Wrote: This is probably the worst necropost ever lol.

Yay! I have a record. Shall we quote it in the hall of shame too?
RE: Logical Absolutes
(November 19, 2016 at 8:44 pm)Faith No More Wrote: The only logical absolute is that there are no logical absolutes.

That's self-evidently absolutely incorrect Tongue
RE: Logical Absolutes
Time to put this thread back to bed for another eighty months. I look forward to its next resurrection.

Mark your calendar, Hammy.

Possibly Related Threads...
Thread Author Replies Views Last Post
  Is there a logical, rational reason why hate is bad? WisdomOfTheTrees 27 2158 February 4, 2017 at 10:43 pm
Last Post: BrianSoddingBoru4
  Matt Dilahunty On The Logical Absolutes Edwardo Piet 30 3853 November 20, 2016 at 8:05 am
Last Post: Edwardo Piet
  Logical contradictions in certain notions of monotheistic deities Mudhammam 5 938 May 7, 2016 at 12:08 pm
Last Post: LadyForCamus
  All Logical Fallacies Heat 20 1743 April 3, 2016 at 10:45 am
Last Post: robvalue
  Is nihilism the logical extreme of atheism? Whateverist 301 27858 October 23, 2014 at 2:26 pm
Last Post: TreeSapNest
  Why all "Logical Proofs Of God" fail ... MitchBenn 90 11105 March 19, 2014 at 7:56 am
Last Post: tor
  Flashy site for logical fallacies. Tiberius 12 4290 August 27, 2012 at 5:07 am
Last Post: Tempus
  A sidenote on moral absolutes liam 15 5609 July 23, 2012 at 1:44 pm
Last Post: liam
  Logical Fallacies Chris.Roth 45 16411 July 8, 2012 at 9:03 am
Last Post: dean211284
  Is it logical to use logic in a illogical universe? British_Atheist 23 8985 June 21, 2011 at 12:51 pm
Last Post: martin02

Users browsing this thread: 1 Guest(s)