Dad links son's suicide to 'The God Delusion'

[allan175]

That is not true then is it? I'm wrong, but it makes me feel good, so I will go on like it is right.

It makes me feel good, and I notice there are millions of Christians donating their time in soup kitchens, disaster shelters and homeless shelters. Without Christianity, you can take away the Sunday soup kitchens for the families that are less-fortunate, and you can take away the disaster shelters for those in need during a natural disaster.

Haha.....So, all charity and helping your fellow man only happens because the people helping are Christians?

I am firmly in the atheist camp but I go and give blood religiously ( ) every 12 weeks. Maybe I should stop because I don't believe in anything supernatural.

EDIT:
And in the UK you don't get paid when you donate (like I think you do in the USA).

[leo-rcc]

The urge to help others is in everyone of us, acting upon it is done by less. Where organized religion does help is focusing the efforts. But that does not mean it couldn't be done by any secular means. There are plenty charities in Holland that are non religious, as well as religious.

[Psalm 23]

That is not true then is it? I'm wrong, but it makes me feel good, so I will go on like it is right.

It makes me feel good, and I notice there are millions of Christians donating their time in soup kitchens, disaster shelters and homeless shelters. Without Christianity, you can take away the Sunday soup kitchens for the families that are less-fortunate, and you can take away the disaster shelters for those in need during a natural disaster.

Haha.....So, all charity and helping your fellow man only happens because the people helping are Christians?

I am firmly in the atheist camp but I go and give blood religiously ( ) every 12 weeks. Maybe I should stop because I don't believe in anything supernatural.

EDIT:
And in the UK you don't get paid when you donate (like I think you do in the USA).

Giving blood is an unselfish deed. I didn't say atheists are not good people. I was saying "if praying makes me feel good, and I believe it can bring peace to the world." then why is that such a bad thing? Why would anyone with a logical thinking brain make up such a crazy statement that "religious people are delusional?" I think that is an extremely ignorant statement, considering the fact that Churches all over the world donate billions of dollars to "feed the hungry and homeless, give presents at christmas charites, soup kitchens on holidays for starving families" How is that delusional?

If anything, I think Richard Dawkins should apologize for his ignorant statements. Calling someone delusional, and calling their God a delusion of the mind is not a good way to express your opinions.

I promise, you will get more angry religious people than people who deconvert.

Bill O'Reilly told Richard Dawkins where he can stick his book..

[allan175]

That is not true then is it? I'm wrong, but it makes me feel good, so I will go on like it is right.

It makes me feel good, and I notice there are millions of Christians donating their time in soup kitchens, disaster shelters and homeless shelters. Without Christianity, you can take away the Sunday soup kitchens for the families that are less-fortunate, and you can take away the disaster shelters for those in need during a natural disaster.

Haha.....So, all charity and helping your fellow man only happens because the people helping are Christians?

I am firmly in the atheist camp but I go and give blood religiously ( ) every 12 weeks. Maybe I should stop because I don't believe in anything supernatural.

EDIT:
And in the UK you don't get paid when you donate (like I think you do in the USA).

Giving blood is an unselfish deed. I didn't say atheists are not good people. I was saying "if praying makes me feel good, and I believe it can bring peace to the world." then why is that such a bad thing? Why would anyone with a logical thinking brain make up such a crazy statement that "religious people are delusional?" I think that is an extremely ignorant statement, considering the fact that Churches all over the world donate billions of dollars to "feed the hungry and homeless, give presents at christmas charites, soup kitchens on holidays for starving families" How is that delusional?

You seem to be associating someone's "goodness" with their "religiosness" again.

Also, you are linking two entirely different things. Dawkins is saying they are delusional because they are believing in something they have no proof or evidence for.
That has nothing to do with their charitable natures or kindness to others that is, in my opinion, an evolved 'feature' that enabled the societies to form and stay together.

[Psalm 23]

The urge to help others is in everyone of us, acting upon it is done by less. Where organized religion does help is focusing the efforts. But that does not mean it couldn't be done by any secular means. There are plenty charities in Holland that are non religious, as well as religious.

That's absolutely correct. Everyone helps everyone. I didn't say that. The point I'm making is that Richard Dawkins believes religious people live in this fantasy world, but in reality, it's the religious people that are over in the Middle East trying to end the violence. I don't see Richard Dawkins in the Middle East trying to bring peace. No, but you do see Christian Missionaries in foreign fields. And the sickening part is, some of these missionaries that are trying to bring peace are being captured and stoned to death, sent to prison for life, beheaded or hanged all for doing nothing but trying to preach a peaceful word.

Christian persecution in the Middle East is frightening!!

How do you justify that?

One religion is trying to save the world, and there is another that is trying to end it by nuclear force.

So, where does "God is a delusion" separate the good from the bad?

---

That is not true then is it? I'm wrong, but it makes me feel good, so I will go on like it is right.

It makes me feel good, and I notice there are millions of Christians donating their time in soup kitchens, disaster shelters and homeless shelters. Without Christianity, you can take away the Sunday soup kitchens for the families that are less-fortunate, and you can take away the disaster shelters for those in need during a natural disaster.

Haha.....So, all charity and helping your fellow man only happens because the people helping are Christians?

I am firmly in the atheist camp but I go and give blood religiously ( ) every 12 weeks. Maybe I should stop because I don't believe in anything supernatural.

EDIT:
And in the UK you don't get paid when you donate (like I think you do in the USA).

Giving blood is an unselfish deed. I didn't say atheists are not good people. I was saying "if praying makes me feel good, and I believe it can bring peace to the world." then why is that such a bad thing? Why would anyone with a logical thinking brain make up such a crazy statement that "religious people are delusional?" I think that is an extremely ignorant statement, considering the fact that Churches all over the world donate billions of dollars to "feed the hungry and homeless, give presents at christmas charites, soup kitchens on holidays for starving families" How is that delusional?

You seem to be associating someone's "goodness" with their "religiosness" again.

Also, you are linking two entirely different things. Dawkins is saying they are delusional because they are believing in something they have no proof or evidence for.
That has nothing to do with their charitable natures or kindness to others that is, in my opinion, an evolved 'feature' that enabled the societies to form and stay together.

When Hurricane Katrina struck New Orleans the Catholic Church donated $50 million to homeless shelters, and they even opened their doors to people that were homeless and needed a place to sleep. Not to sound rude or ignorant, but I wonder if any atheists took them up on that offer in their desperate time of need?

Can you see where you CANNOT call religion "Delusional?" Churches opened their doors for everyone who needed them. And I can assure you not 100% of everyone in those Churches were Christian.

Richard Dawkins' statement is a slap to the face of religious people.

I wonder if Richard Dawkins would have accepted the Churches offerings, or would he have called them delusional for trying to help people?

[Edwardo Piet]

Giving blood is an unselfish deed. I didn't say atheists are not good people. I was saying "if praying makes me feel good, and I believe it can bring peace to the world." then why is that such a bad thing? Why would anyone with a logical thinking brain make up such a crazy statement that "religious people are delusional?" I think that is an extremely ignorant statement, considering the fact that Churches all over the world donate billions of dollars to "feed the hungry and homeless, give presents at christmas charites, soup kitchens on holidays for starving families" How is that delusional?

Because the belief itself IS delusional. And because you don't need to believe in such a delusion to give to charity and be a good person. And because such delusions can be very harmful to the world indeed. Fundamentalists are the main threat. But moderates can also give cover for the fundamentalist believers. Just because they believe in the same nonsensical God. Moderates have been known to prefer more fundamentalist believers in the very same religion as them to militant atheists! Or even more tolerant atheists. And on that point there are even atheists who believe its a load of nonsense and harmful to the world but still think we shouldn't be critical. And people can go around just believing what the hell they want even if its totally delusion and often damaging. Fine if you want to have a delusion that comforts you, fine. But if you don't want to be called delusional and to be challenged then you must "keep thy religion to thyself" as George Carlin would say.

If anything, I think Richard Dawkins should apologize for his ignorant statements. Calling someone delusional, and calling their God a delusion of the mind is not a good way to express your opinions.

That's bullshit. Dawkins is completely correct. God IS a delusion. That's the point of his whole book. He has every right to tell the truth. He shouldn't button his lip just because people are 'offended by it' when they have no right to be. If Dawkins criticized politics, sport, music, etc. He wouldn't get the same reaction. And that's what's wrong. Religion should be allowed to be criticized just as much as politics, sport, music, etc. It shouldn't have so much f**king protection when not only doesn't the thing not allowed to being criticize not exist, unlike politics, sport and music, etc. And is a total delusion. Not only that, but it can be a very harmful belief. It says we are all sinners and the lowest of the low. We are sick and need to get well. And at the same time it says we are the most special creature on the planet and God has plan in mind for us? And that for tens of thousands of years God did nothing and then during the bronze age finally got of his ass and decided to intervene and then there was the bible.
Because of course the human race had been going for thousands and thousands of years.

I promise, you will get more angry religious people than people who deconvert.

But they have no reason or right to be angry. Just as people have no right to be so outraged by constructive criticism. Religion is not sacred. Its delusional and can be completely horrific. It needs criticism otherwise it will get worse. People shouldn't have to put up with such delusional and potentially very harmful bullshit.

Bill O'Reilly told Richard Dawkins where he can stick his book..

But Bill O'Reilly isn't exactly a good role model. The stuff he said to Dawkins is very stupid indeed.
Why don't you stick the bible where the sun don't shine instead? Either that or actual realize its fiction. Its important to history, tradition and the human language. But understand its fictional nonsense and shouldn't be taken seriously or be used to mean that the supernatural exists. That's bullshit. Its certainly not "the word of God". To say God exists is one thing but then to say you know his mind is another. You need a big leap of faith to be a deist but there's a HUGE jump between that and a theist. To say "I know his mind. I know this is the right God."

[leo-rcc]

Christian persecution in the Middle East is frightening!!

How do you justify that?

I don't. Religious persecution by other religions is a bad thing indeed. And done by people that only believe in a slightly different flavour of god as you do. Religion is really awful that way don't you agree?

One religion is trying to save the world, and there is another that is trying to end it by nuclear force.

You mean save, or dominate?

So, where does "God is a delusion" separate the good from the bad?

It doesn't, I've yet to see any evidence that anything good done by the Christian church is not done by other organizations that work of a totally different belief system. Christianity does not have the monopoly on "good".

[MerrieMelodyxx]

Giving blood is an unselfish deed. I didn't say atheists are not good people. I was saying "if praying makes me feel good, and I believe it can bring peace to the world." then why is that such a bad thing? Why would anyone with a logical thinking brain make up such a crazy statement that "religious people are delusional?"

The problem with prayer isn't that it makes you feel good, or even necessarily that you feel it can influence the world around you. The problem is that because you feel that prayer is doing something to influence the world around you, you'll be less likely to do something else to solve the problem. You feel satisfied with your contribution and don't feel it's necessary to continue to address the problem. Out of sight, out of mind.

I think that prayer, sitting quietly with thoughts, having meditation time, whatever you want to call it, are all really good things from a personal health standpoint. I find it much easier to get through the day, deal with high-pressure situations, and stay calm if I take a couple moments at the beginning of the day for myself. I don't expect these moments for myself to have an impact beyond what's in my mind. It's not that's not valuable... it's just not the only thing I rely upon to get things done in my life.

I think that is an extremely ignorant statement, considering the fact that Churches all over the world donate billions of dollars to "feed the hungry and homeless, give presents at christmas charites, soup kitchens on holidays for starving families" How is that delusional?

Is it not possible to feed the homeless and hungry without religion? On a more important tangent, do good works prove the merits of a philosophical stance? If this is the case, I'd say atheism has a good start for being full of merit, at least in my family.

[Psalm 23]

The problem with prayer isn't that it makes you feel good, or even necessarily that you feel it can influence the world around you. The problem is that because you feel that prayer is doing something to influence the world around you, you'll be less likely to do something else to solve the problem.

That is untrue. I can name countless Churches around the world that pray for help, and also donate their time and hard earned money to make sure.. (insert any charity) is provided for this time of crisis.

You feel satisfied with your contribution and don't feel it's necessary to continue to address the problem. Out of sight, out of mind.

Once again, that is untrue. The world's problems are hardly "out of sight, out of mind." How can we NOT face Global terrorism, The World's largest Banks are crashing, Worldwide Economy is about the collaspe any day, Global warming, The U.S recession, The World's three largest auto makers are one month away from total bankruptcy, Nations are rising against Nation in the Mid-East.. I could go on all day long about the world and and it's countdown to Armageddon, but I think you should get the idea.

Everything I have mentioned, it's more than likely since it's mostly within the U.S, These are Christians tackling these issues. I'm quite sure there are Churches praying, U.S Senators, Federal Judges, Supreme Court Judges are primarily Christian faithfuls. I'm also sure they are praying in Church to end this crisis the world is facing. Not to mention, they go to the Office on Monday to deal with this worldwide crisis.

I think that prayer, sitting quietly with thoughts, having meditation time, whatever you want to call it, are all really good things from a personal health standpoint.

Agreed, but to call someone a delusional freak because they pray? I think that is a bit extreme.

I find it much easier to get through the day, deal with high-pressure situations, and stay calm if I take a couple moments at the beginning of the day for myself. I don't expect these moments for myself to have an impact beyond what's in my mind. It's not that's not valuable... it's just not the only thing I rely upon to get things done in my life.

If you are an atheist, and you have found happiness, then let all of the peace in the world be with you. But I guarantee one thing. I'm not going to sit here and call you delusional for not believing in "My" God.

Is it not possible to feed the homeless and hungry without religion?

Every time I flip the channels, I always see a Christian organization with an (800) number to help starving children. They always show those sad pictures of starving children.. they do that so the Christians with the deep pockets can help them.

On a more important tangent, do good works prove the merits of a philosophical stance? If this is the case, I'd say atheism has a good start for being full of merit, at least in my family.

I'm sure there are atheists that do good, Christians do good, Muslims do good, and the Hindus.. Buddhists... everyone helps out. So, in reality, who is delusional? I would think if God can be scientifically disproven, then I would believe religious people may suffer from schitzophrenia. But since the God idea cannot be deflated in any manner.. I don't see the reason for insulting religious folk by calling them delusional.

We are trying to help the world the best we can, and we are being called delusional by a biologist, keep in mind, not a psychiatrist.
No credibility whatsoever in the psychological field of study.

[LukeMC]

Is it not possible to feed the homeless and hungry without religion?

Every time I flip the channels, I always see a Christian organization with an (800) number to help starving children. They always show those sad pictures of starving children.. they do that so the Christians with the deep pockets can help them.

I don't think this addresses the question.
"Is it possible to feed people without religion"
"Christian organisations appeal to christian people for money"

The answer you were looking for is "yes, it is possible. Oxfam, red cross, etc also advertise and don't need a religious backbone to do it."