The Hayter-Braeloch Scale

[Tiberius]

Last year, myself and a theist member of the forums (Arcanus) developed a new "scale of belief" to correct errors in both Dawkins' attempt in "The God Delusion", and my attempt on my blog. Our aim was to create a simple scale that was unambiguous, whilst also using pre-existing terms to avoid confusion. Once we were done, we forgot to publish it, so here it is.

The Hayter-Braeloch Scale

NOTES:

i. The word "gods" in the following scale includes: belief in god (singular), gods (plural), God (personal), and goddess (feminine); and beliefs that "gods" are either involved or uninvolved in the world and its affairs (e.g., monotheism, pantheism, deism, etc.).
ii. The word "gnostic" does not refer to the syncretistic religious movements of Gnosticism, but rather to the cogent strength of the arguments for the existence or non-existence of "gods" (i.e., the premises enjoy greater probability than their denials).
iii. The word "agnostic" does not refer to either the knowability of "gods" or to epistemic apathy, but rather to the questionable strength of the arguments for the existence or non-existence of "gods" (i.e., the premises and their denials are equally probable).
iv. The word "theist" does not refer to a belief in a god who rules the universe, but to belief in god generally. It is the opposite of atheism rather than distinct from deism.

1. Gnostic Theist
Those who believe that gods exist, and hold that the existence of gods can be conclusively established.

2. Agnostic Theist
Those who believe that gods exist, and hold that the existence of gods cannot be conclusively established.

3. Apatheist
Those who are uncertain regarding the existence of gods. They may sometimes 'believe' and other times 'not believe' that gods exist, and question whether the issue has ultimate consequences.

4. Agnostic Atheist
Those who do not believe that gods exist, and hold that the non-existence of gods cannot be conclusively established.

5. Gnostic Atheist
Those who do not believe that gods exist, and hold that the non-existence of gods can be conclusively established.




Comments, criticisms, etc are most welcome

[mem]

I am a four

[Tiberius]

So am I

[leo-rcc]

So where does Dotard fit in this list as he is God?

[Tiberius]

So where does Dotard fit in this list as he is God?

Gnostic theist I guess, assuming he understands the "I think therefore I am" argument for personal existence.

[Paul the Human]

I guess I'd be a 4.5 on that scale. The existence and/or non-existence of god(s) probably cannot be conclusively established, but I am pretty certain that there are none.

[Caecilian]

I'm probably around 4.8

I think that there are a number of arguments that point towards the impossibility of god, but none of them are entirely conclusive.

[Autumnlicious]

I've been a life long 3 with leanings to 4.

I've always asked, if a god exists - does anybody care?

[tavarish]

4.99.

i do have a problem with your definition of theism though, deism should more fit the bill for that kind of assertion. A theist, in the most widely used sense, is a monotheist and believes that God was the creator of the universe and is still around.

Deism can be used sort of as a placeholder for values yet unknown, the "how" of universal origins, rather than the "why", which is what theism tends to deliver.

[Tiberius]

I guess I'd be a 4.5 on that scale. The existence and/or non-existence of god(s) probably cannot be conclusively established, but I am pretty certain that there are none.

I'm probably around 4.8

I think that there are a number of arguments that point towards the impossibility of god, but none of them are entirely conclusive.

So what you both meant was '4'.



I love how people try to create new places on the scale despite the fact it doesn't measure this. Paul invented a new metric of "certainty", whilst Caecilian decided the more arguments you had, the closer to 5 you were

Just to clarify, this scale has 5 points on it. You are one of the 5. It only measures belief and your view on whether the existence of gods can be conclusively established. It doesn't measure the number of arguments, or how certain you are.

@tavarish:

Deism still involves a God, which is why we list it under theism (and explain theism as any concept of God, including the ones you mentioned).