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Is god bound by logic?
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 Is god bound by logic?
August 11, 2010 at 5:12 pm
(This post was last modified: August 11, 2010 at 5:14 pm by Captain Scarlet.)
Can god break the laws of logic ie do the logically impossible or is he bound by logic. If he is bound where did the laws of logic come from. If he can break them then we cannot use logic to reason to a god because they are fallable and seeing as there is no evidence for god we can only conclude he does not exist
Not your logic, no.
Do make an attempt to note the number of logical fallacies you and other atheists commit. I have a list if you want to see it.  (August 11, 2010 at 5:12 pm)Captain Scarlet Wrote: Can god break the laws of logic ie do the logically impossible or is he bound by logic. If he is bound where did the laws of logic come from. If he can break them then we cannot use logic to reason to a god because they are fallable and seeing as there is no evidence for god we can only conclude he does not exist There are no such things as laws of logic.There are invented (not discovered) rules of inference we use which allow logical conclusions. Logic does not guarantee truth,nor is our form of logic the only one. EG Traditional Chinese logic(Mohist logic) for example, is based on analogy, rather than deduction/induction. The neo Platonists began the tradition (which I reject) that truth may be inferred from logic without evidence. Theologians and diverse flavours of theist are exceedingly fond of this form of argument. According to the teachings of the Abrahamic faiths, God can transcend all natural law. Hence the notions of such things as creationism and miracles. 
well first you will have to define logic and then you will have to define a god. You can have a logical explanation about something but without evidence that means nothing. Scientists have a lot of logical theories and some of them were disproved. If you build your logical explanation based on proved facts(for example Laws of Physics) and lets say your god is christian god, then he can't be bound by logic. Becouse if he is, than he can't be existed. and of course its the logical conclusion but if he is not bound by logic our logical conclusion means nothing to him. it's an endless loop..
Quote:Many that live deserve death. Some that die deserve life. Can you give it to them, Frodo? Do not be too eager to deal out death in judgment. Even the very wise cannot see all ends. 
I would say anything that resides outside the universe would not be bound by anything in the universe, unless interacting with this universe. That being the case is logic an axiom that exists outside the universe? I would say no since the types used can even vary amongst this universe as pointed out by padriac. Laws of logic are an abstract construct by humans used to rationalize things found within this universe, just like math. We can use logic to reason anything we can observe. If we can observe it we can analyze it and deduce it's value or causality.
"There ought to be a term that would designate those who actually follow the teachings of Jesus, since the word 'Christian' has been largely divorced from those teachings, and so polluted by fundamentalists that it has come to connote their polar opposite: intolerance, vindictive hatred, and bigotry." -- Philip Stater, Huffington Post
always working on cleaning my windows- me regarding Johari 
What I've noticed is that most people who drone on and on about fucking logic cannot even come up with a reasonable premise.
If your premise is bullshit then all the logic in the world will not help you. (August 11, 2010 at 10:36 pm)RAD Wrote: Not your logic, no. Happy to be shown the errors and logical fallacies so long as those who engage in special pleading, begging the question, compositional errors, appeal to common belief to prove the god accept that similarly there are no arguments and therefore as there is no evidence we are left only with a bronze age superstition magic and mysticism
God's thought processes are so far superior to ours that we can't judge whether or not they are logical. Isaiah 55:8,9 says "For my thoughts are not your thoughts, neither are your ways my ways, declares the Lord. For as the heavens are higher than the earth, so are my ways higher than your ways and my thoughts than your thoughts."
His invisible attributes, namely, his eternal power and divine nature, have been clearly perceived, ever since the creation of the world, in the things that have been made. So they are without excuse.
Romans 1:20 ESV 
god is only constrained by the imagination.
Just like any other fictional character. You can fix ignorance, you can't fix stupid. Tinkety Tonk and down with the Nazis. (August 12, 2010 at 1:25 pm)theophilus Wrote: God's thought processes are so far superior to ours that we can't judge whether or not they are logical. Isaiah 55:8,9 says "For my thoughts are not your thoughts, neither are your ways my ways, declares the Lord. For as the heavens are higher than the earth, so are my ways higher than your ways and my thoughts than your thoughts." If you are going to get all 'bibley' on me can I refer you to gods 'thoughts' in deuteronomy and exodus. Not sure they were superior to my thoughts. We are both superior to god in how we treat prisoners of war their children and wives I surely don't have to go on. But coming away from the bible if god 'lives' outside of the universe and therefore time he cannot think at all. This would be because he would be frozen in stasis with no internal processes. If we allow him to think he must be caught up in time and space and therefore finite and not god. Which is it? |
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