I received this email

[mhikl]

Hi A Theist,

The question, good Theist, is "Can you learn to Think outside your box" (of indoctrinated knowledge)? Those who have been indoctrinated from childhood have a very difficult time with this, indoctrination being such a cheep and thorough means of education, monetarily, time and discipline wise. And it reinforces belief and acceptance over thought and challenge. One can only wonder if the Neanderthals were religious, as their tools changed not a wit in the four-hundred thousand years they existed.

I've lived among Christians and Muslims and Jews. Jews don't seem to talk much about their religion possibly because they take it for what it is and don't feel threatened, in religion, anyways. They've been at "being Jewish" a long time.

Christians and Jews seem fanatical about their strange faiths with the Muslims being the most fanatical. They've been at it the shortest time but their indoctrination is the most thorough starting at home and taking up an inordinate amount of time in school - the memory work is spectacular: Christian kindergarten kids doing Xmas recitations are embarrassing and silly compared to what kindergarten children can do at Eid celebrations for the end of Ramadan. But half the school day over the whole month of Ramadan can be spent in preparation.

That might be one of the reasons for low prize in Nobel wins. The same argument might be used to explain why Jews do so much better than Christians at the game a Christian invented. But I digress. Recitation and praying and lectures and lessons continue throughout grade school. No time for homework, what with the time constrains placed upon it by praying at home and the need for play times since little comes at school and the hours there are so much longer.

My theist friend, have you ever seen the statistics of Christians converting to Islam? There are plenty of converts. The converse is rare. And now you know why. The best indoctrinators have the most marbles. If religious fundamentalism lasts another hundred years in the US, my bet is that Islam, if not the dominant religion practised by USans will, at least, be close to par; and then the Arabs might just get their other holy lands back.

Just something to chew over fellow human being. Indoctrination is mighty powerful.

[A Theist]

Hi A Theist,

The question, good Theist, is "Can you learn to Think outside your box" (of indoctrinated knowledge)? Those who have been indoctrinated from childhood have a very difficult time with this, indoctrination being such a cheep and thorough means of education, monetarily, time and discipline wise. And it reinforces belief and acceptance over thought and challenge. One can only wonder if the Neanderthals were religious, as their tools changed not a wit in the four-hundred thousand years they existed.

I've lived among Christians and Muslims and Jews. Jews don't seem to talk much about their religion possibly because they take it for what it is and don't feel threatened, in religion, anyways. They've been at "being Jewish" a long time.

Christians and Jews seem fanatical about their strange faiths with the Muslims being the most fanatical. They've been at it the shortest time but their indoctrination is the most thorough starting at home and taking up an inordinate amount of time in school - the memory work is spectacular: Christian kindergarten kids doing Xmas recitations are embarrassing and silly compared to what kindergarten children can do at Eid celebrations for the end of Ramadan. But half the school day over the whole month of Ramadan can be spent in preparation.

That might be one of the reasons for low prize in Nobel wins. The same argument might be used to explain why Jews do so much better than Christians at the game a Christian invented. But I digress. Recitation and praying and lectures and lessons continue throughout grade school. No time for homework, what with the time constrains placed upon it by praying at home and the need for play times since little comes at school and the hours there are so much longer.

My theist friend, have you ever seen the statistics of Christians converting to Islam? There are plenty of converts. The converse is rare. And now you know why. The best indoctrinators have the most marbles. If religious fundamentalism lasts another hundred years in the US, my bet is that Islam, if not the dominant religion practised by USans will, at least, be close to par; and then the Arabs might just get their other holy lands back.

Just something to chew over fellow human being. Indoctrination is mighty powerful.

"Can you learn to Think outside your box" (of indoctrinated knowledge)? Those who have been indoctrinated from childhood have a very difficult time with this,

Both my stepfather and mother were atheists. Until I was 17, I probably only attended church services, maybe three times in my childhood.
The topic is an email that was forwarded to me. I thought the subject matter was provocative enough to make for interesting discussions, especially on this forum where there are strong opinions. That's why I posted it.

[Dotard]

There is NOT one single Jew that has destroyed a church.

Jesus was a Jew.

Didn't he tear up a church in protest of traders/money changers there?

.....nor have leaders calling for Jihad and death to all the Infidels.

Mmmmm... I seem to remember somewhere in the Bibical teachings about if someone suggests worshipping another God (Infidelity) you are to kill him with your own hand.

[A Theist]

There is NOT one single Jew that has destroyed a church.

Jesus was a Jew.

Didn't he tear up a church in protest of traders/money changers there?

.....nor have leaders calling for Jihad and death to all the Infidels.

Mmmmm... I seem to remember somewhere in the Bibical teachings about if someone suggests worshipping another God (Infidelity) you are to kill him with your own hand.

Jesus was a Jew.

Didn't he tear up a church in protest of traders/money changers there?

He turned their tables over and drove them out of the synagouge. I'd hardly call that tearing it up.
How does that compare to Islamic terrorists bombing christian churches in Pakistan, Turkey, or elsewhere?

Mmmmm... I seem to remember somewhere in the Bibical teachings about if someone suggests worshipping another God (Infidelity) you are to kill him with your own hand.

Mmmmm...I seem to recall a few Old Testament scriptures on that myself. A Rabbi, or someone instructed in Judaism could answer that better for you than I could.

[Minimalist]

Jesus was a Jew.

Didn't he tear up a church in protest of traders/money changers there?

No more than Luke Skywalker blew up the Death Star.

[Rev. Rye]

At one time, the Muslims also made great contributions to science, mathematics, literature, and other fields of study.

See this:
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Islamic_Golden_Age

Yes, at one time they had at least enough tolerance of other religions to not try and destroy any evidence that there were any useful meditations on morality before their own religion came about like Christianity did.

[HeyItsZeus]

At one time, the Muslims also made great contributions to science, mathematics, literature, and other fields of study.

See this:
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Islamic_Golden_Age

I was about to bring this up.

[annatar]

How does that compare to Islamic terrorists bombing christian churches in Pakistan, Turkey, or elsewhere?

I never recall anyone bombing church in Turkey. In fact I live near a church and never seen it got bombed..
Guys Islam is a stupid religion. But not all muslims are terrorists. Actually most of them are quite peaceful just like majority of christians... Islamic terror usually emerges in unstable and undeveloped countries.( which is essentially created by western countries.. I guess the joke's on you..) it has nothing to do with religion.. Believe me if they were christian they would bomb you for not being Good christians...

and if you want to compare jews and muslims, add their attack to an aid ship on international waters. They killed 9 unarmed civilian. Israel acts like pirates in somalia.. They are just as bad as terrorists...

[KichigaiNeko]

I am thinking that the saddest part is that what we have here is just stupid people being stoopid people and using God / Yaweh / Allah / Jesus as the scape-goat for their own bigotry.

Many muslims that I know are just ordinary people getting on with it (aka living) in a style that suits them, they cause no angst or drama. Same with any other religion you care to name. Pity that there are those who are soo narrow minded and insecure that they have to stir up trouble. Just because I don't do the religion thing or god (s) is no cause for me to go about beating other people up about MY beliefs (or lack there of)

Will draw the line with the full face burka....sorry guys but in this country you cover your face only if you are a criminal or your husband has beat you and here in Aus this is not tolerated very well. Mind you...here you WILL gets jokes aimmed at your favourite deity and they will not be kind...suck it up

[DeistPaladin]

At one time, the Muslims also made great contributions to science, mathematics, literature, and other fields of study.

See this:
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Islamic_Golden_Age

No, at one time, the ARABS made great contributions to science, mathematics, literature and other fields of study. Europe owes a debt of gratitude to the ARAB world for keeping Greco-Roman learning alive. It was only when the stranglehold of Christianity was broken that Europe clawed its way out of the Dark Ages.

The last thousand years has been a story of trading places between the Christian and Islamic world. Now the Islamic world languishes in the Dark Ages. My hypothesis is that a moderate form of Islam during the Middle Ages allowed for the culture of learning that flourished during the "Golden Age". It wasn't that Islam promoted this learning. It was that Islam didn't get in the way. Now it does.

The more devoutly religious a society is, the more intellectually bankrupt and culturally backward it becomes.