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Evolution is not evolutionary!
#21
RE: Evolution is not evolutionary!
(August 24, 2017 at 10:17 am)Anomalocaris Wrote: Okay, your cancer analogy is not all together applicable to evolution in bacteria, although it is a little more applicable to evolution in more complex organisms.

Evolution occurs when the genes of a particular organism is altered in such a way that the organism becomes more likely to succeed in reproducing in the environment in which it find itself.   However, bacterias are unlike more complex organisms in that bacterias engage in lateral gene transfer.  This means different bacterias in the same environment can trade genes without reproduction.  So bacteria's heritable traits are not entirely defined by the genes it inherited when it first came into existence.   When a bacteria reproduce, it can be passing on genes it didn't inherited from its parent.  So evolution in bacteria are far more chaotic and less susceptible to a clean inheritance model that work for more complex cells.

(August 24, 2017 at 10:16 am)Gawdzilla Sama Wrote: Evolution is change through time. Not a runaway growth that ends up dead.

There are cancer cells that can spread to other individuals and thus continue to propagate even if the cancer kills the original host.
Yep, change through time. But your example is just stupid.
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#22
RE: Evolution is not evolutionary!
(August 24, 2017 at 12:32 pm)Cyberman Wrote:
(August 24, 2017 at 9:21 am)vorlon13 Wrote: They left a few heteros in Britain ??

Tongue

One, at least.

I'm always amused when people like professors Dawkins, Myers and Tyson, and even people like Thunderf00t, speak out about religious matters, those with vested interests call for them to stick to science. Yet people like the minister in the OP can expound on science till the cows come home, and that's considered perfectly fine in some quarters.

Good point.

And the religiousites even get testy at simply being asked a question by someone outside of their club.

For instance, I already know this little jewel is going to get the stink eye, but I REALLY want to know:


The second time Jesus was crucified, did they use the same nail holes as the day before ??
 The granting of a pardon is an imputation of guilt, and the acceptance a confession of it. 




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#23
RE: Evolution is not evolutionary!
(August 24, 2017 at 1:19 pm)Gawdzilla Sama Wrote:
(August 24, 2017 at 10:17 am)Anomalocaris Wrote: Okay, your cancer analogy is not all together applicable to evolution in bacteria, although it is a little more applicable to evolution in more complex organisms.

Evolution occurs when the genes of a particular organism is altered in such a way that the organism becomes more likely to succeed in reproducing in the environment in which it find itself.   However, bacterias are unlike more complex organisms in that bacterias engage in lateral gene transfer.  This means different bacterias in the same environment can trade genes without reproduction.  So bacteria's heritable traits are not entirely defined by the genes it inherited when it first came into existence.   When a bacteria reproduce, it can be passing on genes it didn't inherited from its parent.  So evolution in bacteria are far more chaotic and less susceptible to a clean inheritance model that work for more complex cells.


There are cancer cells that can spread to other individuals and thus continue to propagate even if the cancer kills the original host.
Yep, change through time. But your example is just stupid.

Then god did it. Best I got.
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#24
RE: Evolution is not evolutionary!
How?
At the age of five, Skagra decided emphatically that God did not exist.  This revelation tends to make most people in the universe who have it react in one of two ways - with relief or with despair.  Only Skagra responded to it by thinking, 'Wait a second.  That means there's a situation vacant.'
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#25
RE: Evolution is not evolutionary!
(August 24, 2017 at 3:05 pm)Court Jester Wrote:
(August 24, 2017 at 1:19 pm)Gawdzilla Sama Wrote: Yep, change through time. But your example is just stupid.

Then god did it. Best I got.

You could educate yourself. Here's where I started. 

[Image: 51lQlvzbD7L.jpg]

[Image: EvolutionForDummies.jpg]
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#26
RE: Evolution is not evolutionary!
(August 24, 2017 at 9:18 am)zebo-the-fat Wrote: Australians came from Britain, why are there still British people?

Because they only sent their criminal element.

perhaps a better question would be, why are their still british criminals?

Huh
Dying to live, living to die.
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#27
RE: Evolution is not evolutionary!
(August 24, 2017 at 5:23 pm)The Valkyrie Wrote:
(August 24, 2017 at 9:18 am)zebo-the-fat Wrote: Australians came from Britain, why are there still British people?

Because they only sent their criminal element.

perhaps a better question would be, why are their still british criminals?

Huh

They kept the Lords.
If you get to thinking you’re a person of some influence, try ordering somebody else’s dog around.
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#28
RE: Evolution is not evolutionary!
(August 24, 2017 at 8:03 am)ignoramus Wrote: I just watched a riveting documentary by a seemingly intelligent church minister commenting on the rise of complexity of natural evolution. Which sounded quite cerebral. Compared to the crap he spewed out for morning mass at St Marys only 10 minutes prior!)

But he did get me thinking!
He said the oldest known multicellular life on fossil record is bacteria.
He wanted to know then why, if evolution is true and works the way they say it does, why is there still bacteria just as simple now as it was then!
He said that he understands that some life take a little longer to develop than others (he mentioned little Agatha, his village idiot), but 3.5 billion years of nothing simply means evolution is wrong! (and we'll just slip God right in when no-one's looking thank you very much)

I'm sold.
I'm starting to convert! someone help me! I'm losing focus .... I'm cold now ...


Worship Worship Worship

Iggy, I can solve your doubts with a baseball bat.

See you at Christmas.
Dying to live, living to die.
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#29
RE: Evolution is not evolutionary!
There's no reason something would die out unless it was unfit for it's environment. So it makes sense that bacteria would still be around. It's hard to imagine there not being something for it to feed on.
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#30
RE: Evolution is not evolutionary!
(August 24, 2017 at 8:05 pm)Industrial Lad Wrote: There's no reason something would die out unless it was unfit for it's environment. So it makes sense that bacteria would still be around. It's hard to imagine there not being something for it to feed on.

And remember, evolution is directionless, there's no goal. So bacteria that are good at being bacteria wouldn't have to die out. 

We now have bacteria that eat nylon. The predecessors didn't, but one of them changed a wee bit, able to digest nylon in tiny amounts. As the amount of nylon increased other food sources are pushed out, and the ones that could eat even that wee bit had an slight advantage. Some of their descendants changed a bit more, and so on. The huge number of generations per day of bacteria allowed this change to occur in a relatively short time.
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