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My proofs for Islam
#31
RE: My proofs for Islam
My Proofs Wonder Woman Lives In My Closet:

1) I said so.
2) If in doubt, see number 1.
Reply
#32
RE: My proofs for Islam
The Case for Christianity:

(November 17, 2018 at 12:21 pm)MysticKnight Wrote: Terms to understanding The Bible

If a book is to be a guidance from God regarding all matters that pertain to guidance,  it needs us to reflect to perceive guidance we need. Any reflection is good, but what is not good is relying on conjecture or relying that which is unclear from the Bible as opposed to clear signs and bright insights it provides.

A book filled of parables:

Jesus said, ‘Look, a sower went out. He filled his hands (with seeds), (and) he scattered (them). Some fell on the path, and the birds came and pecked them up. Others fell on the rock, and did not take root in the soil, and they did not put forth ears. And others fell among the thorns, they choked the seeds, and worms ate them. And others fell on good soil, and it produced good fruit. It yielded sixty per measure and one hundred twenty per measure.’  - Thom 9

Parables are a useful utility to convey to make people understand. Those who believe will know exactly what God meant by the parable and be guided by it. Those who disbelieve, due to the fact, understanding would lead to faith and guidance, will instead argue or not perceive and say "what is that God means by this parable?".

The name of God is a parable at the end because God can't be limited by a language term for a name.  Those who believe will know it's the truth from their Lord, as they do when God strikes other parables.

The transgressors are the only people who the parables just confuses them more and they become more misguided due to them.

If instead, you reject My statutes, and if your soul abhors My ordinances so as not to carry out all My commandments, and so break My covenant.’ Leviticus 26:15

Following what is unclear from the book:

And he said to them, “To you has been given the secret of the kingdom of God, but for those outside everything is in parables, so that “they may indeed see but not perceive, and may indeed hear but not understand, lest they should turn and be forgiven.” - Mark 4:11-12

From the Bible come clear signs, they are the original and of the true Word of Christ revealed to Paul and the clear signs are in accordance to insights provided to him and that the provides to others. 

From it will also come unclearness, things that are unclear by language to mean something but people hold on to The Gospels. They remind them of the past chosen families who were the rope from God and rope from humans, as the rope of God, that were coupled with the revelations revealed.

The Eyewitnesses of Christ wrote the Gospels to clarify God’s message and so were the family of the reminder:

I will always be ready to remind you of these things, even though you already know them, and have been established in the truth which is present with you. I consider it right, as long as I am in this earthly dwelling, to stir you up by way of reminder, knowing that the laying aside of my earthly dwelling is imminent, as also our Lord Jesus Christ has made clear to me. -Peter 1:12-16

Unclearness from The a Bible was not meant to be unclear, but rather, we are supposed to seek clarification. 

The Gospels in this regard, are meant to help us uncover what is in The Old Testament, and what the Bible itself confirms. As parable may true or false, fabricated or truly said by one of God's trusted interpreters, we are to refer them back to the New Testament for  clarification. of what is true and what is false.  The Gospels confirm it.

The mistake of Christians in this regard was underestimating Bible. We will show, however, that the rituals, their details, etc, all is found in the Bible, and where The Word is explicit, the Gospels compliment it implicitly, and where The Word is implicit the Gospels compliment the interior of it.

A sign that the Bible is from God, is this nature of it.  Those who build their foundations on only what is clear, will find it continuously unraveling wonders. While those who due to their injustice, hold on to what is unclear, will be destroyed by it and in it's own words it will increase them in nothing but perdition.

Dear MK,

Above, I have made the case for Christianity instead of Islam using your own argument.  I expect you to be floored by my undeniable logic and clear proofs, and I await the announcement that you have converted to a believing Christian.
Nay_Sayer: “Nothing is impossible if you dream big enough, or in this case, nothing is impossible if you use a barrel of KY Jelly and a miniature horse.”

Wiser words were never spoken. 
Reply
#33
RE: My proofs for Islam
(November 17, 2018 at 12:59 pm)LadyForCamus Wrote:
(November 17, 2018 at 12:21 pm)MysticKnight Wrote: Terms to understanding The Bible

If a book is to be a guidance from God regarding all matters that pertain to guidance,  it needs us to reflect to perceive guidance we need. Any reflection is good, but what is not good is relying on conjecture or relying that which is unclear from the Bible as opposed to clear signs and bright insights it provides.

A book filled of parables:

Jesus said, ‘Look, a sower went out. He filled his hands (with seeds), (and) he scattered (them). Some fell on the path, and the birds came and pecked them up. Others fell on the rock, and did not take root in the soil, and they did not put forth ears. And others fell among the thorns, they choked the seeds, and worms ate them. And others fell on good soil, and it produced good fruit. It yielded sixty per measure and one hundred twenty per measure.’  - Thom 9

Parables are a useful utility to convey to make people understand. Those who believe will know exactly what God meant by the parable and be guided by it. Those who disbelieve, due to the fact, understanding would lead to faith and guidance, will instead argue or not perceive and say "what is that God means by this parable?".

The name of God is a parable at the end because God can't be limited by a language term for a name.  Those who believe will know it's the truth from their Lord, as they do when God strikes other parables.

The transgressors are the only people who the parables just confuses them more and they become more misguided due to them.

If instead, you reject My statutes, and if your soul abhors My ordinances so as not to carry out all My commandments, and so break My covenant.’ Leviticus 26:15

Following what is unclear from the book:

And he said to them, “To you has been given the secret of the kingdom of God, but for those outside everything is in parables, so that “they may indeed see but not perceive, and may indeed hear but not understand, lest they should turn and be forgiven.” - Mark 4:11-12

From the Bible come clear signs, they are the original and of the true book revealed to Paul and the clear signs are in accordance to insights provided to him and that the provides to others. 

From it will also come unclearness, things that are unclear by language to mean something but people hold on to The Gospels. They remind them of the past chosen families who were the rope from God and rope from humans, as the rope of God, that were coupled with the revelations revealed.

The Eyewitnesses of Christ wrote the Gospels to clarify God’s message and so were the family of the reminder:

[iTherefore, I will always be ready to remind you of these things, even though you already know them, and have been established in the truth which is present with you. I consider it right, as long as I am in this earthly dwelling, to stir you up by way of reminder, knowing that the laying aside of my earthly dwelling is imminent, as also our Lord Jesus Christ has made clear to me. -Peter 1:12-16[/i]

Unclearness from The a Bible was not meant to be unclear, but rather, we are supposed to seek clarification. 

The Gospels in this regard, are meant to help us uncover what is in The Old Testament, and what the Bible itself confirms. As parable may true or false, fabricated or truly said by one of God's trusted interpreters, we are to refer them back to the New Testament for  clarification. of what is true and what is false.  The Gospels confirm it.

The mistake of Christians in this regard was underestimating Bible. We will show, however, that the rituals, their details, etc, all is found in the Bible, and where The Word is explicit, the Gospels compliment it implicitly, and where The Word is implicit the Gospels compliment the interior of it.

A sign that the Bible is from God, is this nature of it.  Those who build their foundations on only what is clear, will find it continuously unraveling wonders. While those who due to their injustice, hold on to what is unclear, will be destroyed by it and in it's own words it will increase them in nothing but perdition.

Dear MK,

Above, I have made the case for Christianity instead of Islam using your own argument.  I expect you to be floored by my undeniable logic and clear proofs, and I await the announcement that you have converted to a believing Christian.

So far I have not made the case for Islam. Like I said in my previous post, I am just building blocks. Once the blocks are built, and you see enough of the structures (Surahs) and their place in the book, we can discuss miracle aspects of it.

Till then, we have no common ground to work with.

And so far, we are just understanding sneak peaks of what the Quran is supposed to be. We are just slowly looking at blocks and building with it. I have not proven any of it's blocks are true in their claim as of yet that is their claim to be from God and true. We are just building and seeing what it says.
Reply
#34
RE: My proofs for Islam
(November 17, 2018 at 1:04 pm)MysticKnight Wrote:
(November 17, 2018 at 12:59 pm)LadyForCamus Wrote: Dear MK,

Above, I have made the case for Christianity instead of Islam using your own argument.  I expect you to be floored by my undeniable logic and clear proofs, and I await the announcement that you have converted to a believing Christian.

So far I have not made the case for Islam. Like I said in my previous post, I am just building blocks. Once the blocks are built, and you see enough of the structures (Surahs) and their place in the book, we can discuss miracle aspects of it.

Till then, we have no common ground to work with.

And so far, we are just understanding sneak peaks of what the Quran is supposed to be.  We are just slowly looking at blocks and building with it.  I have not proven any of it's blocks are true in their claim as of yet that is their claim to be from God and true. We are just building and seeing what it says.

Me too, but for Christianity.  Nice how we can use this same exact reasoning for literally ANY religious book!  I’m so excited for you to become a Christian!
Nay_Sayer: “Nothing is impossible if you dream big enough, or in this case, nothing is impossible if you use a barrel of KY Jelly and a miniature horse.”

Wiser words were never spoken. 
Reply
#35
RE: My proofs for Islam
Oh man... you got to see some degree of the book and understand key aspects of it, before we can discuss whether it's claims are true or not. I haven't claimed to prove anything of it.

But you are going to have to let me bring about it's wonders. It's like a building, you have to build with blocks. But the blocks have to be understood. So you put the in the building. But at the same time, the blocks in themselves mean nothing in themselves, you just go to understand a bit here and there, and keep building.

I relate with programming in this regard. You make functions and you have to modify them later. But you have to build somewhat dynamically, and waterfall approach doesn't work with regards to most programs and applications.
Reply
#36
RE: My proofs for Islam
(November 17, 2018 at 12:34 pm)MysticKnight Wrote:
(November 17, 2018 at 12:28 pm)LadyForCamus Wrote: You have learned absolutely NOTHING from our previous conversation.  Same thing over and over, expecting different results, and all that Jazz.

You have to understand some degree of The Bible if you are going to perceive any miraculous aspects of it.   We are just building some of those blocks.

But to see structure, you have to see it's place in The Bible. And to see the place of it's signs and proofs in it, you have to see it's flow in the Gospels. And so to really see any of the "signs" of God in the The Bible, you have to see the Bible over all, not understand every minute detail, but begin to see it's structure and form.

I am just building. All I ask you is to persevere, remain patient, and reflect.  If any of what I say so far is unclear, as for clarification, and I will try my best to clarify.

Fixed that for ya. 😉 I DARE you to try and refute me.
Nay_Sayer: “Nothing is impossible if you dream big enough, or in this case, nothing is impossible if you use a barrel of KY Jelly and a miniature horse.”

Wiser words were never spoken. 
Reply
#37
RE: My proofs for Islam
Oh, ok. LadyForCamus, I can't help you in this regard. If you can't see that you have to let someone present the proof before you can dismiss it. Then it's hard to dialogue with you.

It's like as if someone is proving something to you with a non-religious topic, and you keep interrupting and say I can say this about x y z and don't even let them finish.

We aren't discussing the Bible or Christianity. However a great deal of Quran comments on the trinity interpretation, and we can look at that as well, since Unity of God is the highest foundation of the Quran.


Build blocks. In the meanwhile, if you have any edge-cases (like conceptions you have the Quran that bother you), bring them up, and perhaps we can discuss or clarify them.
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#38
RE: My proofs for Islam
What ever “proof” you think you have for Islam, I have exactly the same “proof” for Christianity, which means it’s not proof at all, lol. But go ahead. I’ve got my shoe and my A1 all plated up.
Nay_Sayer: “Nothing is impossible if you dream big enough, or in this case, nothing is impossible if you use a barrel of KY Jelly and a miniature horse.”

Wiser words were never spoken. 
Reply
#39
RE: My proofs for Islam
There is archetype arguments in Quran that other religions can use as well. For example arguments for God's unity, for why God would send Prophets, etc, Judaism can use as well.

The subject of not interpreting by opinion and imposing one's view on a holy book, all religions should use. The concept that a holy book should clarify itself, is expected of all claims of holy books.

We are just building blocks dear Noble LadyForCamus.

I'm not saying they are proofs yet. We are actually just building understanding of what Quran says. Then when you build enough of that, perhaps we can identify if it has miracle aspects and discuss them.
Reply
#40
RE: My proofs for Islam
When magic book shows that it's more magic and less book there might be a "miracle aspects" discussion to be had.  The only thing that's miraculous in any of this, thusfar, is that you believe the book is magic in the first place.  

Has it done anything recently?  Levitate, spin around in circles, whip up a tasty chocolate mousse?
I am the Infantry. I am my country’s strength in war, her deterrent in peace. I am the heart of the fight… wherever, whenever. I carry America’s faith and honor against her enemies. I am the Queen of Battle. I am what my country expects me to be, the best trained Soldier in the world. In the race for victory, I am swift, determined, and courageous, armed with a fierce will to win. Never will I fail my country’s trust. Always I fight on…through the foe, to the objective, to triumph overall. If necessary, I will fight to my death. By my steadfast courage, I have won more than 200 years of freedom. I yield not to weakness, to hunger, to cowardice, to fatigue, to superior odds, For I am mentally tough, physically strong, and morally straight. I forsake not, my country, my mission, my comrades, my sacred duty. I am relentless. I am always there, now and forever. I AM THE INFANTRY! FOLLOW ME!
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