The dawn of civilization

[Peebothuhlu]

At work.

What 'Magic'?

Or are you now seeking to change the label on something objective such as to dismiss things?

Anthopology and archeology both are the science of studying humanities (And our related, extinct, cousin species) history.

I admit to finding your insistence on the 'Written word' as the only metric to use strange.

That is a tu quoque fallacy.  Any "Written word" has nothing to do with his claim.  He either has something that objectively provides a date, or there's no reason to assume it as being objective. 

As far as your objection on its own, I never dated anything in such a way, so I don't see why I would need to justify it.

What the what now?

Uhm..... you started mentioning 'The written word', not myself.

I asked you why you seemed to have such a high metric for 'The written word'.

My position was that there are/were more methods for transferring and storing information (As it pertains to human ideas) than just 'The written word'. Hence my recommendation to reading Prof Kelly's book.

As for archeologists and anthropologist? I would say 'Yes' they have robust methods for working out the dates of the things they are studying.

[T0 Th3 M4X]

At work.

That is a tu quoque fallacy.  Any "Written word" has nothing to do with his claim.  He either has something that objectively provides a date, or there's no reason to assume it as being objective. 

As far as your objection on its own, I never dated anything in such a way, so I don't see why I would need to justify it.

What the what now?

Uhm..... you started mentioning 'The written word', not myself.

I asked you why you seemed to have such a high metric for 'The written word'.

My position was that there are/were more methods for transferring and storing information (As it pertains to human ideas) than just 'The written word'. Hence my recommendation to reading Prof Kelly's book.

As for archeologists and anthropologist? I would say 'Yes' they have robust methods for working out the dates of the things they are studying.

Even if I did say "written word", I certainly never asserted a date.  If you feel I did, please provide the post #, and I will gladly apologize and retract my statement.  But I'm certain I never dated anything 6000 years old, on the basis I don't believe that as being likely, so it wouldn't make sense for me to proclaim such a thing.  So no chance of me even whoppsying it into a post.  Regardless, it's still independent of his assertion.

I know there are archeologists and anthropologists who attempt to date things, but in most cases they can come up with a rough estimate at best.  Of course some events are easier to approximate than others.

As far as your question about having a "high metric", can you maybe clarify what you are looking for.  High metric in regard to what?  I'm not trying to dodge it but rather answer it more thoughtfully in the context in which you are attempting to ask it.

[Peebothuhlu]

At work.

What the what now?

Uhm..... you started mentioning 'The written word', not myself.

I asked you why you seemed to have such a high metric for 'The written word'.

My position was that there are/were more methods for transferring and storing information (As it pertains to human ideas) than just 'The written word'. Hence my recommendation to reading Prof Kelly's book.

As for archeologists and anthropologist? I would say 'Yes' they have robust methods for working out the dates of the things they are studying.

Even if I did say "written word", I certainly never asserted a date.  If you feel I did, please provide the post #, and I will gladly apologize and retract my statement.  But I'm certain I never dated anything 6000 years old, on the basis I don't believe that as being likely, so it wouldn't make sense for me to proclaim such a thing.  So no chance of me even whoppsying it into a post.  Regardless, it's still independent of his assertion.

I know there are archeologists and anthropologists who attempt to date things, but in most cases they can come up with a rough estimate at best.  Of course some events are easier to approximate than others.

As far as your question about having a "high metric", can you maybe clarify what you are looking for.  High metric in regard to what?  I'm not trying to dodge it but rather answer it more thoughtfully in the context in which you are attempting to ask it.

Okay.

So... We are both happy with acknowledging that there are other ways beyond the written word to store and transfer knowledge.

We are both happy with acknowledging that professionals in their fields have good and robust methods for working out the dates of things happening in said feilds.

I am completely unaware of what you're reffering to with the 6000 number.

[T0 Th3 M4X]

At work.

Even if I did say "written word", I certainly never asserted a date.  If you feel I did, please provide the post #, and I will gladly apologize and retract my statement.  But I'm certain I never dated anything 6000 years old, on the basis I don't believe that as being likely, so it wouldn't make sense for me to proclaim such a thing.  So no chance of me even whoppsying it into a post.  Regardless, it's still independent of his assertion.

I know there are archeologists and anthropologists who attempt to date things, but in most cases they can come up with a rough estimate at best.  Of course some events are easier to approximate than others.

As far as your question about having a "high metric", can you maybe clarify what you are looking for.  High metric in regard to what?  I'm not trying to dodge it but rather answer it more thoughtfully in the context in which you are attempting to ask it.

Okay.

So... We are both happy with acknowledging that there are other ways beyond the written word to store and transfer knowledge.

We are both happy with acknowledging that professionals in their fields have good and robust methods for working out the dates of things happening in said feilds.

I am completely unaware of what you're reffering to with the 6000 number.

I thought I read 6000 years somewhere.  Maybe it was from another post somewhere or it could just be my head getting frazzled.  It's after midnight here.  Anyway, please disregard.

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The 6000 years was from Bucky's post.  Sorry about that.  Again, after midnight and my mind is getting frazzled.  Don't get me wet after midnight either, or the results will be even worse.

[Amarok]

At work.


Okay.

So... We are both happy with acknowledging that there are other ways beyond the written word to store and transfer knowledge.

We are both happy with acknowledging that professionals in their fields have good and robust methods for working out the dates of things happening in said feilds.

I am completely unaware of what you're reffering to with the 6000 number.

I thought I read 6000 years somewhere.  Maybe it was from another post somewhere or it could just be my head getting frazzled.  It's after midnight here.  Anyway, please disregard.

---

The 6000 years was from Bucky's post.  Sorry about that.  Again, after midnight and my mind is getting frazzled.  Don't get me wet after midnight either, or the results will be even worse.

Meh midnight messes with everyone

[Gawdzilla Sama]

Sorry, but when we're talking billions of years a "crude estimate" is certainly within the ballpark. But I'm interested in how crude they actually are.

[Bucky Ball]

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It's (6,000) in the OP, trollish one. Shouldn't you be saying your prayers ? 
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Paleolithic_religion

I didn't assert the OP.  Why would I be responsible for its claims?  I'm responsible for what I assert.

That is unless I assert someone else's assertions as being my own assertions, but I didn't assert such an assertion.

Get back to your prayers bozo .... no one said you had anything to do with the OP. YOU asked where the 6,000 came from. 
Do try to follow along, dear.

[T0 Th3 M4X]

I thought I read 6000 years somewhere.  Maybe it was from another post somewhere or it could just be my head getting frazzled.  It's after midnight here.  Anyway, please disregard.

---

The 6000 years was from Bucky's post.  Sorry about that.  Again, after midnight and my mind is getting frazzled.  Don't get me wet after midnight either, or the results will be even worse.

Meh midnight messes with everyone

Yes sir. I'm certainly no exception. Sometimes I can have a mind meltdown too when the dogs start fussing at each other.  I have one that likes to bother the other when he wants something the other has, then it's nonstop fussing and growling.    After a minute or two, it's rattling around my head, and the crazy dog will go on for an hour if you don't stop him.  Actually I posted a video of him doing it in the pet section where he's trying to get the waffle.

[Bucky Ball]

"People need to just chill out. Fear, anger, aggression. The path to the dark side are they
Im changing my approach cos the fear and paranoia is contagious in here and spreads like wildfire.

So instead of starting from modern times I’ll start from ancient times.
Many things define civilization but im taking written language as the major component in this case as it tells us the history…
What are the facts. What do we know

The oldest documented civilizations  date back to around 6,000BC and they all started with 2 major changes; agriculture and religion. After this the rest follows. Written language, mathematics, money, trading, taxes and all the other things that make up society. Scientific theory tells us that modern man has walked the earth for 200,000 years."

..... from post #1. It did not originate with me.

[Gawdzilla Sama]

"People need to just chill out. Fear, anger, aggression. The path to the dark side are they
Im changing my approach cos the fear and paranoia is contagious in here and spreads like wildfire.

So instead of starting from modern times I’ll start from ancient times.
Many things define civilization but im taking written language as the major component in this case as it tells us the history…
What are the facts. What do we know

The oldest documented civilizations  date back to around 6,000BC and they all started with 2 major changes; agriculture and religion. After this the rest follows. Written language, mathematics, money, trading, taxes and all the other things that make up society. Scientific theory tells us that modern man has walked the earth for 200,000 years."

..... from post #1. It did not originate with me.

Why do you change your font size?

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We don't know if religion came first or civilization. I think superstition, not organized religion, would have been around for a long time. But religion requires that a caste of people do nothing actually productive, meaning there's a surplus of food. We know that sacrifices entailed the smoke going to "heaven" while the meat was eaten on Earth. From there it seems logical that parasites attached themselves to a thriving civilization.