So U think Vegan is healthy?

[MJ the Skeptical]

I never said that you can be guaranteed to live to 100, that's your straw man. I said Dan Buettner's research shows that the capacity of the human body is around 90 years, however life expectancy all over the world is lower. He mentions that research shows that genetics are 10% responsible for longevity and that diet/lifestyle are 90% responsible.

Uh huh, because anyone who lives past 90 is going past their capacity... right...The capacity is at 90 yet we can live longer, could you get any more ironic? or just more dumb...Either one.

I was the one that said it was not a guarantee to live 90 and you contradicted me, you dipshit.

Where is your source the assertion that the human body's capacity is about 200 years?

It's funny (ironic) because you didn't provide anything for your 90 year assertion, so I guess you're just as fucking inept with evidence aren't ya?

There you go, using the word 'irony' incorrectly again.

Or you're just too fucking stupid to see the irony, either one.

There's that irony again of projecting what you're doing onto me.

That irony of projecting what I've said to you onto me.

It irks me that you continue to use irony incorrectly, even after I took the time to explain it to you.

That's pretty ironic, but in a way that's clearly over your head.

You know that it's really pathetic just how much you use labels and insults.

But you are a fuckwit, so the shoe fits, Cinderella.

So what? We eat plenty of other mammals like Cattle, Pigs and Sheep. What makes Whales more special than these?

We? speak for yourself straw man making douche. You never asked me if I was okay with eating pigs or sheep, or animals like; dogs, cats, monkies, horses or even people which are customary in some places. Why the fuck would you assume what I eat? that makes you look even fucking dumber for crying straw man and claiming you never made any of your own. Ironic

You did not. Some people need meat for muscle gain, others can gain muscle without meat on a short term basis, but there's no evidence that people can (generally speaking) continue to gain muscle long-term (20-year+) on a vegan diet.

Actually yes I did if you had a good memory.

Are you denying that there are athletes who are not vegans or even vegetarians who are less strict than vegans? So, I did bring something up, intellectually dishonest little guy, better go pray for forgiveness to your sky daddy for being a lying sack of shit.

No, you use the word a lot but you don't know how to use it properly. Don't feel too stupid, there's plenty of other who don't know what irony means. Here's an example:

An irrelevant youtube video as a rebuttal, not shocked that you have no substance in your posts, but it's all good. Retards gon' be retards.

I'm not being mean, I'm telling you that you're using the word irony wrongly. I have numerous examples of you, now, using the word to mean things it doesn't.

Idiots don't have valid opinions on what words mean, sorry. Here's an E-hug though.

"Equate your arguments with veganism"? See, just about everything you accuse me of is your own invention. Did I accuse you of making every claim that a vegan would make or something? No. Just the one, the one that you did make.

What was with all the Anti-Vegan rhetoric towards me then?

It's not a straw man if it actually happened you stupid fuck.

Go read a dictionary, believe it or not there are some Yanks who know the English language, you're just not one of them.

Yanks lol, so you're some limey little brainwashed anglican moron who likes to argue over dumb shit (like nationality for example). Who the fuck brings in nationality? like your a nation of English professors. Fuck off.

Go make more threads telling fat people they're stupid for being fat, you piece of shit.

[Aractus]

Uh huh, because anyone who lives past 90 is going past their capacity... right...The capacity is at 90 yet we can live longer, could you get any more ironic? or just more dumb...Either one.

I was the one that said it was not a guarantee to live 90 and you contradicted me, you dipshit.

You are such a fucking troll. I said no such thing. I also am not the one saying that the human life capacity is 90, and you still haven't provided any evidence that the human life capacity is 200??

It's funny (ironic) because you didn't provide anything for your 90 year assertion, so I guess you're just as fucking inept with evidence aren't ya?

It's not my assertion, and what I gave you was an academic reference.

So what? We eat plenty of other mammals like Cattle, Pigs and Sheep. What makes Whales more special than these?

We? speak for yourself straw man making douche. You never asked me if I was okay with eating pigs or sheep, or animals like; dogs, cats, monkies, horses or even people which are customary in some places. Why the fuck would you assume what I eat? that makes you look even fucking dumber for crying straw man and claiming you never made any of your own. Ironic

You're not a part of the "we", dumbass.

Are you denying that there are athletes who are not vegans or even vegetarians who are less strict than vegans?

Asking me the same question again. As I told you before, there are no examples of elite athletes who were born into a vegan lifestyle from vegan parents, what you have are examples of people presently on a vegan lifestyle, a diet that in the USA should last an average of about 9 years (as is the case for vegetarian diets generally).

An irrelevant youtube video as a rebuttal, not shocked that you have no substance in your posts, but it's all good. Retards gon' be retards.

It makes you look like a complete fool, the way you continue to use 'irony' incorrectly. Do whatever you want.

Idiots don't have valid opinions on what words mean, sorry.

Once again you show your complete lack of ability to discuss a topic or argue for your case. You have no idea what the definition of irony is so you start labelling me as an idiot. Totally pathetic.

What was with all the Anti-Vegan rhetoric towards me then?

It's not a straw man if it actually happened you stupid fuck.

Um how about, it's not towards you. When I say "vegans say this" and "vegans say that" I'm talking most specifically about the bullshit on PETA or 30bananasaday, etc, not saying that you said it, there's a difference. Vegans claim, for instance, that a vegan lifestyle is healthier for everyone. You made claims similar to this, but I didn't say you made the specific claim.

Yanks lol, so you're some limey little brainwashed anglican moron who likes to argue over dumb shit (like nationality for example). Who the fuck brings in nationality? like your a nation of English professors. Fuck off.

So you bring in religion, I bring in nationality, and you get all pissed off about it.

Go make more threads telling fat people they're stupid for being fat, you piece of shit.

Nice straw man. But I can see that you don't care to understand what other people's opinions are before evaluating them - I don't think people are stupid for being fat, I think it's stupid to allow yourself to become so in the first place. That's a big difference, I'm calling the skinny pre-fat people stupid for becoming fat post-tense, not the other way around. I wouldn't expect you to understand that.

You didn't answer any of my questions, so fuck off.

[MJ the Skeptical]

You are such a fucking troll. I said no such thing. I also am not the one saying that the human life capacity is 90, and you still haven't provided any evidence that the human life capacity is 200??

"the capacity of the human body is around 90 years" ...So disingenuous.

It's not my assertion, and what I gave you was an academic reference.

Which proved nothing. We can go beyond that capacity of 90 years.

You're not a part of the "we", dumbass.

Then use a better term than an overarching word like "we" if you don't want confusion, especially while whining straw man fallacies. Ironic.

In the context of what you were saying, you were saying we eat other animals therefore why are whales so special. Ya know, ignorant shit.

Asking me the same question again. As I told you before, there are no examples of elite athletes who were born into a vegan lifestyle from vegan parents, what you have are examples of people presently on a vegan lifestyle, a diet that in the USA should last an average of about 9 years (as is the case for vegetarian diets generally).

So what, that doesn't mean there aren't any, based on your own lack of research or an appeal to ignorance.

There obviously have been, you can't be stupid enough to think every athlete was born and raised on meat.

It makes you look like a complete fool, the way you continue to use 'irony' incorrectly. Do whatever you want.

The irony is still on your end. Sorry you're too stupid to realize it.

Once again you show your complete lack of ability to discuss a topic or argue for your case. You have no idea what the definition of irony is so you start labelling me as an idiot. Totally pathetic.

What fucking case...You consistently argued with yourself to ramble on irrelevantly about your hatred of veganism.

For someone claiming I have a lack of ability to discuss something you sure as hell aren't very good at making your case either it seems, hmm...

Um how about, it's not towards you. When I say "vegans say this" and "vegans say that" I'm talking most specifically about the bullshit on PETA or 30bananasaday, etc, not saying that you said it, there's a difference. Vegans claim, for instance, that a vegan lifestyle is healthier for everyone. You made claims similar to this, but I didn't say you made the specific claim.

Let's go back full circle to my earlier posts about the lack of relevance out of you. I don't give a damn what they say, it's not relevant to my posts, and it never was. Stay on topic with the next person who has the displeasure of being addressed by you from now on, thanks. You're the actual troll bringing up irrelevant topics to ad-nauseam, then saying you never thought I was vegan even though you spent lots of your time trying to refute veganism. I kept telling you, stay on topic, but to no avail.

So you bring in religion, I bring in nationality, and you get all pissed off about it.

Yank? who the fuck said I was American? that's so ignorant. The irony of these actual straw man's while you're crying straw man is laughable. How is nationality relevant...Also, I'm not pissed, that's another straw man you're making. I asked you a question in this sentence and you ducked another one, who could have known. As far as your beliefs, go cry in your cheerios that I mocked your archaic beliefs. At least my criticisms were pretty relevant, you just assumed someones nationality like an idiot.

Nice straw man. But I can see that you don't care to understand what other people's opinions are before evaluating them - I don't think people are stupid for being fat, I think it's stupid to allow yourself to become so in the first place. That's a big difference, I'm calling the skinny pre-fat people stupid for becoming fat post-tense, not the other way around. I wouldn't expect you to understand that.

It's clearly you that doesn't know what a straw man is and this is the final nail in your coffin. You fucking wrote that title word for word then you try to qualify your callous statement with "It's stupid to allow yourself to become fat" but you don't think they're stupid lol yeah, whatever, prick. It's funny because what's in bold is contradicted by what's in italics, your statements are virtually the same. Your stupid thread was completely insipid and people were disagreeing with you vehemently. Including me who called you an asshole for making a blanket judgment of an entire group of people who may have been born fat or have bad genetics for example. Not everyone loses weight the same or has the same metabolism, just more factors ignored to disparage the overweight.

You didn't answer any of my questions, so fuck off.

I did, you're just too stupid to know it. Why don't you fuck off instead? I asked you first if you recall.

[Aractus]

You are such a fucking troll. I said no such thing. I also am not the one saying that the human life capacity is 90, and you still haven't provided any evidence that the human life capacity is 200??

"the capacity of the human body is around 90 years" ...So disingenuous.

It's not my assertion, and what I gave you was an academic reference.

Which proved nothing. We can go beyond that capacity of 90 years.

Provide your references for your claims that: 1. "the human body is built for about 200 years" and 2. "we can go beyond the capacity of 90 years". You seem to be saying that because some people live longer than 90 that the human life capacity being 90 is wrong (that's a little like saying that a 5'10 50 year old can continue to grow taller because some people are 6'4). The phrase, as used by Dan Buettner is to mean the 'normal' or 'standard' capacity, not that there aren't any exceptions.

Asking me the same question again. As I told you before, there are no examples of elite athletes who were born into a vegan lifestyle from vegan parents, what you have are examples of people presently on a vegan lifestyle, a diet that in the USA should last an average of about 9 years (as is the case for vegetarian diets generally).

So what, that doesn't mean there aren't any, based on your own lack of research or an appeal to ignorance.

There obviously have been, you can't be stupid enough to think every athlete was born and raised on meat.

Let me rephrase what I said because I'll admit I didn't say it very clearly.

There are no examples of elite athletes (Bronze-Silver-Gold medallists etc) that were born into a vegan lifestyle by life-long vegan parents, just as there are no examples of life long vegan societies thriving and reproducing.

The irony is still on your end. Sorry you're too stupid to realize it.

You're a complete idiot. You can't back up any assertions you make, you can't or won't define "straw man" or "irony" and you think that any argument you dislike is a straw man argument.

Go buy a dictionary.

Once again you show your complete lack of ability to discuss a topic or argue for your case. You have no idea what the definition of irony is so you start labelling me as an idiot. Totally pathetic.

What fucking case...You consistently argued with yourself to ramble on irrelevantly about your hatred of veganism.

Here you go again, making labels. "I hate veganism", according to you: wrong. What I hate is one aspect of veganism that has become like a cancer and grown throughout the vegan culture, and that is the extremist animal-rights, the extremist claims for health and wellbeing that are unfounded or wrong, and the rest of the extremism that goes along with it (like eliminating an entire food group perceiving it to be unhealthy). There are aspects to veganism that I do like, and I think Alex Jamieson is one of the people that promotes the right approach, but sadly she's hated by an awful lot of extremist "ethical" vegans now and that sums up what I don't like.

I would agree 100% with AJ that some people find vegan diets helpful on a short term or medium term basis, and that people should listen to their bodies.

Yank? who the fuck said I was American? that's so ignorant.

Learn to use English and I won't call you a Yank.

It's clearly you that doesn't know what a straw man is and this is the final nail in your coffin. You fucking wrote that title word for word then you try to qualify your callous statement with "It's stupid to allow yourself to become fat" but you don't think they're stupid lol yeah, whatever, prick. It's funny because what's in bold is contradicted by what's in italics, your statements are virtually the same. Your stupid thread was completely insipid and people were disagreeing with you vehemently. Including me who called you an asshole for making a blanket judgment of an entire group of people who may have been born fat or have bad genetics for example. Not everyone loses weight the same or has the same metabolism, just more factors ignored to disparage the overweight.

I think you've missed 90% of my point with that thread. You've chosen to focus on a single issue. What do obese people see in the mirror when they think about their bodies?

Obesity affects: self confidence, hormone levels, self-image, body-image (obviously) to name a few. It can also cause health problems like sleep apnoea, diabetes and arthritis to name just a few. Obese people then look in the mirror and say "why didn't I do something about this 10/15/20/30 years ago?"

I asked the same question to do with smoking, FYI, and I maintain that people are too stupid to believe that the consequences will affect them - they become wilfully ignorant. That's what the topic is about, you've simply taken my position and twisted it. As I've said many times, smokers don't actually believe that they will get cancer. Point in fact, a friend of mine survived Leukaemia a couple of years back in his mid-20's, he's a regular smoker. I said to him recently "you shouldn't smoke it'll give you cancer" and he said "I've already had cancer" - as if, because he's had it once he can't get it again.

[MJ the Skeptical]

Yeah, because all British people have perfect English, you fallacious fuckwit. Don't cry straw man next time if you're going to make them yourself.

[KichigaiNeko]

So just where are your references that qualify the 200 year life span of the human body QT?

---

I only found this reference (still have to go through it though)
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Maximum_life_span

And then there is this one
http://t.answers.com/answers/#!/entry/ho...22b82cc9f5

And yet this one

http://onswipe.com/thedailygalaxy/#!/ent...22b82456ff


Like I stated, I am yet to read through these articles. But are these what you are referring to?

---

There is also the issue of DNA repair capacity being uninterrupted (which is never the case) and replicating EXACTLY for the given life span.

The issue of environmental and dietary regime along with other stressors have actually modified our DNA as I am to understand; to the point that we are currently evolving into another sub-species of Homo sapien sapiens

---

Yes, the English never did learn how to speak English,....have pity on us poor colonials.

[MJ the Skeptical]

So just where are your references that qualify the 200 year life span of the human body QT?

---

I only found this reference (still have to go through it though)
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Maximum_life_span

And then there is this one
http://t.answers.com/answers/#!/entry/ho...22b82cc9f5

And yet this one

http://onswipe.com/thedailygalaxy/#!/ent...22b82456ff


Like I stated, I am yet to read through these articles. But are these what you are referring to?

---

There is also the issue of DNA repair capacity being uninterrupted (which is never the case) and replicating EXACTLY for the given life span.

The issue of environmental and dietary regime along with other stressors have actually modified our DNA as I am to understand; to the point that we are currently evolving into another sub-species of Homo sapien sapiens

---

Yes, the English never did learn how to speak English,....have pity on us poor colonials.

Not sure if the guy who argued with me misread what I said or I misspoke but, I don't want to being implying that people can live 200 years now--only that it's possible to do so.

I was talking from the angle of people using Transhumanism. But that link of yours from onswipe was interesting, thanks for sharing.

[KichigaiNeko]

This also came up on my news feed

http://www.medicalnewstoday.com/articles/275859.php

Curious.

[psychoslice]

Any diet can be healthy if balanced right, a meat eater who doesn't eat meat like a dog can be as healthy as a vegan, or maybe even more so, it all comes down to balance.

[BlackSwordsman]

THINK AGAIN!

Found this on youtube, here is a video from a Vegan's (Honey) youtube account:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=pMd9i3LYoJk

Apparently one of many where she talks about her various ailments. Here's another one:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=5TL1sDC0oJ8

At 4:54 Honey says about her condition: "there are no treatments to make it go away". Okay so you get the gist of it, she is unable to stand for long lengths of time and spends most of her life lying down, has seen dozens of doctors to no avail.

Next, on a paleo diet:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=T3Px5-9dn3o

And this will probably trip you out, 3 months on Harley gives an update on his diet...

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Gx8pt0Ygrzo

• After only 3 months of eating fresh cuts of beef, lamb, venison and chicken I have gained so much strength and muscle mass. I would never have guessed I would be making a video like this. Doctors told me my condition seemed permanent and degenerative. I was literally shopping for a wheelchair just before the switch. As you can see, I have a strong will, but I physically couldn't work out before, because long-term veganism made my body weak.
  
  I was raised vegetarian vegan on a healthy diet, no fast food crap. I was a sprinter and a ballet dancer, but I always struggled with weakness and chest pain during exercise. However, my health got worse and worse over the years, and I was chronically ill from age 7. I never wanted to give in and eat defenseless animals, and I had not seen enough evidence to support it being necessary for health. I defended myself all through school, researched healthy diets and tried to figure out why I was sick. Doctors did all the tests they could, noone could figure it out. I was on painkillers, antibiotics and eventually an inhaler.
  
  I came off it all and tried to make my diet the healthiest it could be. I tried all the different vegan diets I could over the course of 5 years, but I was only getting sicker and sicker.
  
  I was finally convinced to eat meat by Dr Loren Cordain's work, and the documentary "The Perfect Human Diet". I did not expect eating this way would heal me, as nothing had worked so far. However, it is so clear that diet is the reason for my improvement in health, as it is the only variable that changed in my life. I can also feel a massive difference in my body and mind since eating this way. Veganism caused me so much suffering, sometimes it's unbearable to think about. I'm lucky to be alive.
  
  Vegans: I've actually saved many thousands of animals from death with my previous work educating people about cruel animal rearing practices. I now choose to eat the most ethical meat I can, and consume it with gratitude.
  
  Please share this video, especially with any sick vegans or vegetarians. Noone could give me a good reason to eat meat before I read Dr Loren Cordain's research. I then read about dietary lectins, which seem to trigger my worst symptoms. Those two pieces of knowledge saved my life, so please share with those who need to know.
  
  SCIENTIFIC PAPER WRITTEN BY DR LOREN CORDAIN: http://www.direct-ms.org/pdf/Evolutio...
  
  Follow me on social media websites to join in on the fun!
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So much for vegan diets being healthy!

If I wasn't in medical school getting my Masters Degree in Nutrition and I wasn't or haven't been vegan for a very long time I would have believed it.

I chock it up to piss poor nutritional education.

In case your wondering I am also opening up my own practice.



But your right veganism will make you sick. It ISNT healthy.

I don't recommend it to many people for the following reasons

1. Education on Nutrition is almost non-existant
   
2. People do not understand what the body needs and where to get it
   

I have many vegan friends, though my side of the argument comes from visual observation of case studies and patient data I can tell you that in America where I currently reside the education on nutrition is next to invisible and obesity is 69%. Most of the cases I have seen involve cardiac issues, high cholesterol, etc.

Not saying Vegan is THE way to go but if you want Harvard Medical provided interesting research on the subject of Vegetarianism and even threw the Vegans a scrap of credit.


Please no insults, I respect your choice to eat what you want to eat. I am not forcing my views or studies just providing them and they are open to whomevers interpretation.

Take it or leave it. I can probably dig up the Medical Article from the University if you message me.

But that is my two cents.