Determinism Is Self Defeating

[paulpablo]

I have always considered determinism to be completely irrational for the following reason:

If a determinist is trying to convince me to change my mind and accept determinism, then he or she is accepting that I have free will and can choose between accepting the two theories.

It's like someone talking to you, saying "you can't hear anything" - well if I can't hear then why are you talking to me? Doesn't that make you completely irrational?

It's as simple as that, to win a debate with a determinist you just need to let the determinist talk.

The only reason why I think determinists have this position is not because of logical effort, (A child can tell you that an animal is different from a rock.) But it's more than likely that determinismt believes this to avoid responsibility for their actions, and let's face it, that's very attractive to some people.

I pretty much believe determinism works out, but this doesn't mean someones mind can't be changed by someone else, it can be but it was always bound to happen due to the given conditions. It would be nonsense for me to throw away all responsibilities by saying "it was pre determined to happen" unless I can see what was bound to happen retrospectively, since being able to view yourself in the present from the future is impossible using determinism as a tool to get rid of responsibilities would also be impossible.
And I still feel guilt over actions I've taken and I still feel proud of accomplishments I've achieved, just because I believe they were always bound to happen due to the circumstances doesn't mean the accomplishments didn't take a lot of effort.