(October 10, 2013 at 6:42 am)Esquilax Wrote:(October 10, 2013 at 6:36 am)Lion IRC Wrote: Science is the product of mind/consciousness.
How about you start with simple single cell abiogenesis FIRST.
Then you can have a crack at explaining how consciousness arose.
So I have to account for literally everything in the universe that led up to the modern scientific method before I can use the scientific method? The one that is useful in that it has the ability to explain those things? You can't honestly be that stupid.
But, I'll tell you what: you explain to me how god created everything, and then you can have a crack at using the intelligence you think he gave you to communicate with me sufficient to ask me a question. I mean, it's only fair, under your logic.
God is conscious, intelligent "mind".
Information is only perceived by minds.
If we perceive information, design, intent, free will, scientific methods which conform to a SYSTEM that makes epistemic 'sense', then either we ARE God or we are LIKE God.
You say information is 'accidental' or an illusion and that fine tuning is just some massive trompe l'oeil but we see both chaos AND order. We can discern the laws of nature (which make science possible) AND we can see/imagine alternatives where those laws break down or defy intuition.
God can invoke a singularity like something out of nothing quicker than you can say "quantum weirdness". And the beauty of The God Conclusion is that we aren't left wondering why or being forced to invoke "gaps reasoning" by way of words like...mutation, spontaneous, random, dark energy, multiverse, uncertainty principle,.