Faith is a measure of irrationality

[RobbyPants]

What is having a lot of faith?

Being extra credulous.

[Thumpalumpacus]

Favorite quote time!


Faith is being persuaded and fully committed in trust, involving a confident belief in the truth, value, and trustworthiness of God. When it comes to Christianity, 'faith' is defined by three separate but vitally connected aspects (especially from Luther and Melancthon onwards): notitia (informational content), assensus (intellectual assent), and fiducia (committed trust). So faith is the sum of having the information, being persuaded of its truthfulness, and trusting in it. To illustrate the three aspects: "Christ died for ours sins" (notitia); "I am persuaded that Christ died for our sins" (notitia + assensus); "I deeply commit in trust to Christ who I am persuaded died for our sins" (notitia + assensus + fiducia). Only the latter constitutes faith, on the Christian view.

Consequently, notitia and fiducia without assensus is blind and therefore not faith. This shipwrecks the egregious canard that faith is merely a blind leap. Faith goes beyond reason—i.e., into the arena of trust—but never against reason. From the Enlightenment onwards, faith has been subject to constant attempts at redefining it into the realm of the irrational or irrelevant (e.g., Kant's noumenal category); but all such attempts are built on irresponsible straw man caricatures that bear no resemblance to faith as held under the Christian view: notitia, assensus, and fiducia.

Great, one more reason to look askance at philosophy.

[Bad Wolf]

Faith is the excuse people give for believing in something when there isn't any evidence. Because if they had evidence, they wouldn't need faith.

[JesusHChrist]

Faith is mindless blabbering, based on a failed epistemology. Faith allows the believer to make knowledge claims about things they cannot possible know. Fail.

If the believer had evidence, do we have any doubt how vigorously it would be put on display? Faith would be locked up under the stairs like crazy Uncle Lester. "Shut up you! We'll get you some BBQ baby in a sec! IN A SEC!"

But nope. No decent evidence, so we get faith as the fall back.

[KUSA]

If God speaks to you why would you need faith? Sounds stupid. If I heard that mofo I wouldn't have any doubts.

[The Grand Nudger]

Oh, if I heard god I'd have some pretty serious doubts - about my state of mind.

[fr0d0]

Me too

[Anomalocaris]

Faith itself is not a measure of irrationality. Faith is an often useful heuristic tool to avoid psychological paralysis in the face of inadequate information or evidence about the relative merits of an array of alternative paths that can be taken.

Faith only becomes an manifestation of irrationality when it is used to support an alternative in defiance of weight of evidence and available information.

[Tonus]

When does faith become stupid?

When it is improperly defined.

In Hebrews 11:1, Paul defines faith as the "assurance of things hoped for, a conviction of things not seen." The example of the person grabbing an umbrella when he sees indications that it might rain applies here, though I would substitute "expected" in place of "hoped for." If you have a friend who is very reliable, you will come to have faith in him when he agrees to something. If he says he'll pick you up tomorrow at 10am, you have faith that he'll be there.

The idea that faith in god doesn't require clear evidence of his existence, or even that it is incompatible with proof of same, is not what Paul was talking about. After all, in verse seven he says "By faith Noah, being warned of God concerning things not seen as yet, moved with godly fear, prepared an ark to the saving of his house." Noah had direct evidence of god's existence and received specific instructions on what to do and how to do it. So where did faith come in? In that he trusted that if god said he would flood the Earth, he would do so.

As far as I am concerned, if you need faith to believe that god exists, then you're doing it wrong.

[ThomM]

You've heard people say it before, "I have faith" or so and so has a lot of faith. What does that mean really? What is having a lot of faith?

It would seem that having a lot of faith is the act of tenatiously rejecting reality. You walk out your house without an umbrella even though you've got big gray clouds in the sky. Is this faith?

If I keep telling myself that something unlikely to happen will, does that constitute faith?

When does faith become stupid? When do adults take responsibility for their own lives? Does someone who believes they can walk on water have more faith than somone who believes they will pass a test?

I remember being in a restuarant and a man came in and said he was a man of faith. He had an incredible sense of superiority. It's sad that a bold statement like that can be said with such gusto in 2014.

I think faith is directly proportional to irrationality.

The word "faith" is not inherently a religious word - it applies in LOTS of non-religious areas - and is not generally irrationality. In fact - it is normally based on Past Experience - which is indeed rational.

So - when you have faith that a person will do what they say - when your past experience with that person indicates that they are good for their word - is simply recognizing that they are more likely to do what they say - than someone who is NEVER good for their word. It is much like the faith you have in your parents when you were a child.

As far as religious "faith" - it is not irrational, When confronted with a world where most people believe that some kind of god (or gods) existed and created the Universe - it is not irrational - especially if YOU have been told by an otherwise reliable source (like a parent).

But - when confronted with the LACK of provable truth in religion -especially when you are educated to question things - it is rational to question what you have been told - and based on the results of those questions and lack of answers - it would then be irrational to continue to accept religion.