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RE: Christians. Prove That You Are Real/True Christians
August 31, 2015 at 11:29 am
(August 31, 2015 at 10:37 am)FifthElement Wrote: (August 31, 2015 at 8:17 am)Drich Wrote: We don't get to decide who is and who is not 'christian' making the distinction is the job of Christ at the final judgement.
So in your own opinion, which side (and how sure about it you are) you are going to, heaven or hell ?
How would you feel towards God and his final judgement if you end up in hell ? 
If I wind up in hell again, I will know that I absolutely deserve it. I asked for a second chance, and got it, then I screw it up again. I would turn and rightfully embrace my fate.
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RE: Christians. Prove That You Are Real/True Christians
August 31, 2015 at 11:38 am
(August 31, 2015 at 10:44 am)Divinity Wrote: The God of the bible is kind of an asshole. So I imagine he'd just send fucking everybody to hell. Saying "Nope, you were't good enough. Yeah, I died for your sins, and that just pissed me off even more." I guess a couple of people who made it into his book that he favored might get in. if you won the lottery, and invited everyone you wanted over to a party to give them some money/set them up with some of your winnings.. and 1/4 showed up because they needed more than your word/what you were willing to provide as proof that you won the lottery, and the words of those who know you closely.
would you give those who didn't show up anything? what if those who did not show up not only refuse your invitation but said bad things about you and those closest to you? What if even some of those who did not show up, beat up and stole from those who you have given to? Would you feel obligated to give them anything?
Now what of those who out right hate you and wish ill on you and yours because you have been good to them, and have not met those who hate you on their terms?
That is where most of you are. You not only want to deny God you hate God, and yet would demand Him to meet you on your terms. Why would God want to do this? Who are you to demand this?
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RE: Christians. Prove That You Are Real/True Christians
August 31, 2015 at 11:48 am
No, it'd be more like this:
If you won the lottery, and wanted to give people some of your winnings. But you didn't tell anyone that you won the lottery, and didn't send out any invites. You just expect them to show up. And those that do show up, you expect to follow certain rules, some of which don't make any sense. Like you expect them to wear sandals on their hands, and to not carry a wallet on them.
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RE: Christians. Prove That You Are Real/True Christians
August 31, 2015 at 11:51 am
It means believing that Jesus is the Son of God who came and died for us and rose again. It also means believing in and trying to follow his teachings and example. <3
"Of course, everyone will claim they respect someone who tries to speak the truth, but in reality, this is a rare quality. Most respect those who speak truths they agree with, and their respect for the speaking only extends as far as their realm of personal agreement. It is less common, almost to the point of becoming a saintly virtue, that someone truly respects and loves the truth seeker, even when their conclusions differ wildly."
-walsh
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RE: Christians. Prove That You Are Real/True Christians
August 31, 2015 at 12:02 pm
(This post was last modified: August 31, 2015 at 12:05 pm by robvalue.)
Belief isn't a choice, so by this criteria no one has any control over whether they can or can't be a true christian. I'm instantly out of the running, and there's nothing I can do about it. People can choose to assess all the evidence, but they can't choose to believe something they don't believe, or vice versa. This is headed for the calvanist view.
For example, I can't choose to believe I can fly, no matter how much I might want it to be true. I'd have to really mess with my brain in some serious ways to achieve such a belief. I could probably still convince myself of that more readily than I could convince myself there was a man walking about who was the son of god.
You can choose to say you believe it, of course. Why this would be impressive to anyone, and especially god, I don't know!
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RE: Christians. Prove That You Are Real/True Christians
August 31, 2015 at 12:04 pm
(August 31, 2015 at 12:02 pm)robvalue Wrote: Belief isn't a choice, so by this criteria no one has any control over whether they can or can't be a true christian. I'm instantly out of the running, and there's nothing I can do about it. People can choose to assess all the evidence, but they can't choose to believe something they don't believe, or vice versa.
For example, I can't choose to believe I can fly, no matter how much I might want it to be true. I'd have to really mess with my brain in some serious ways to achieve such a belief. I could probably sill convince myself of that more readily than I could convince myself there was a man walking about who was the son of god.
You can choose to say you believe it, of course.
I agree with all this, rob. 
"Of course, everyone will claim they respect someone who tries to speak the truth, but in reality, this is a rare quality. Most respect those who speak truths they agree with, and their respect for the speaking only extends as far as their realm of personal agreement. It is less common, almost to the point of becoming a saintly virtue, that someone truly respects and loves the truth seeker, even when their conclusions differ wildly."
-walsh
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RE: Christians. Prove That You Are Real/True Christians
August 31, 2015 at 12:07 pm
Really? OK  So it's a matter of luck then whether or not you're a true Christian? Luck that you have the kind of brain that will believe such claims?
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RE: Christians. Prove That You Are Real/True Christians
August 31, 2015 at 12:10 pm
(August 31, 2015 at 12:07 pm)robvalue Wrote: Really? OK So it's a matter of luck then whether or not you're a true Christian? Luck that you have the kind of brain that will believe such claims?
I'd say "luck" probably does play a role at least with some people. But it's also life experiences I think, that may lead someone to believe/disbelieve certain things.
I agree that sometimes a person can't really help it if they do/don't believe in something. Even if they want to or don't want to.
"Of course, everyone will claim they respect someone who tries to speak the truth, but in reality, this is a rare quality. Most respect those who speak truths they agree with, and their respect for the speaking only extends as far as their realm of personal agreement. It is less common, almost to the point of becoming a saintly virtue, that someone truly respects and loves the truth seeker, even when their conclusions differ wildly."
-walsh
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RE: Christians. Prove That You Are Real/True Christians
August 31, 2015 at 12:11 pm
(August 31, 2015 at 11:51 am)Catholic_Lady Wrote: It means believing that Jesus is the Son of God who came and died for us and rose again. It also means believing in and trying to follow his teachings and example. <3
jesus is a jerk.. just saying.
Luke 6:26 -> Mark 16:15-16
try comparing Matthew 5:16 with Matthew 6:1, or John 14:27 with Matthew 10:34, or 2 Kings 2:11 with John 3:13, or Exodus 33:11 with John 1:18, or Mark 9:40 with Luke 11:23.
Mark 11:24-> John chapter 14, verses 12 through 14
Matthew 4:8 <- jesus told a lie in fact he tells several lies just google it
even god lied too
Atheism is a non-prophet organization join today.
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RE: Christians. Prove That You Are Real/True Christians
August 31, 2015 at 12:12 pm
Life experiences, sure. So if I went to be a true Christian, my only hope is to persue life experiences which might make me able to believe such a claim?
If so, it may well be possible that the only "experiences" capable of making me believe that claim involve directly screwing around with my brain using surgery/drugs.
This is all a bit weird, yeah?
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