Bernie Sanders Rocks My World!

[lrh9]

He supports a flat tax system. Doesn't matter that the poor are threatened by their poverty. Doesn't matter that the poor have to accept whatever the wealthy give them. He thinks it's a good thing. He thinks it's equality. He isn't looking for anything logical, like money. He can't be bought, bullied, reasoned or negotiated with. He just wants to watch the world burn.

[Jaysyn]

Except the rich are left with 9.000.000 and the poor are left with 9.000, 9.000 might not be enough to survive(i don't live in america so i don't know the prices) while 9.000.000 is just too much cash for a person to recieve monthly

That's one fairly weak argument you've got there.

The inherent vice of capitalism is the unequal sharing of blessings; the inherent virtue of socialism is the equal sharing of miseries.

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He supports a flat tax system. Doesn't matter that the poor are threatened by their poverty. Doesn't matter that the poor have to accept whatever the wealthy give them.

In Adrian's defense, every outline for a proposed Flat Tax system I've seen doesn't actually tax folks & families at or near the poverty level. So it would be like our horribly Byzantine system is now in regards to that.

I think simplifying the tax code would be a wonderful goal. Hell, if a party would run, state or federal, on the sole purpose of reviewing every law on the relevant books & throwing out any outdated or unconstitutional laws, I'd vote for them in a split-second.

[lrh9]

Yeah. Fuck that son of a bitch making 900 USD monthly. A flat tax is fair. He pays the same percentage as someone making over 100,000 USD monthly. If the person making 100,000 USD is taxed even half a percentage point more it's unfair and wrong, and that uppity fucking poor man needs to be taught a lesson about fairness and equality. He's greedy and he is making other people suffer because he just wants enough money to pay his rent, keep his heat on, feed himself, and have transport to go to his job where he has the nerve to demand a minimum wage - for 12 hours of hard labor - from the person making 100,000 USD a month, his boss. The nerve of some fuckers.

[Jaysyn]

I would pose the situation as being these people need to work to eat and further that there is no excuse for the working conditions many of these "third world" sweat shop laborers find themselves in. The fact that people lose the birthright of their dignity in order to have enough food to survive makes this current system socially evil.

I think there is actually a fairly easy fix for the problem of 3rd world sweatshops. Make it a Federal felony to sell to or import into the USA any product that was manufactured in those conditions. Give companies a one year grace period to change their behavior or supply line. Lean on our allies to pass the same kind of legislation. Alternatively, we could impose large tariffs on companies that use sweatshop labor. If it's no longer profitable the behavior will stop.

This would be completely Constitutional, falling squarely under the Commerce clause & the FTC.

Feel free to poke holes in my idea..

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Yeah. Fuck that son of a bitch making 900 USD monthly. A flat tax is fair. He pays the same percentage as someone making over 100,000 USD monthly. If the person making 100,000 USD is taxed even half a percentage point more it's unfair and wrong, and that uppity fucking poor man needs to be taught a lesson about fairness and equality. He's greedy and he is making other people suffer because he just wants enough money to pay his rent, keep his heat on, feed himself, and have transport to go to his job where he has the nerve to demand a minimum wage - for 12 hours of hard labor - from the person making 100,000 USD a month, his boss. The nerve of some fuckers.

You forgot your strawman tags.

BTW, did you not even read what I just typed? Under every Flat Tax proposal I've ever read about, someone making $900 a month ($10,800 annually) wouldn't pay a dime in taxes. Just like it is now.

[DeistPaladin]

If you want a higher rate for the rich, then I put to you that you are an enemy of equality, since you want to treat people who are rich in a different way to people who are poor.

The rich benefit from the blessings of society not by a proportional amount but by an exponential amount. It's only fair to ask them to pay not just the same percentage but a larger percentage of their income for the upkeep of the society that's been so good to them.

This is not about righting past wrongs. This is about equity today.

[Jaysyn]

It's only fair to ask them to pay not just the same percentage but a larger percentage of their income for the upkeep of the society that's been so good to them.

I'm not sure about that part. I think if you can take away the tax shelters, loopholes & start taxing capital gains again, a flat tax would work out well. I guess, like everything else, it depends on the implementation.

[lrh9]

You forgot your strawman tags.

BTW, did you not even read what I just typed? Under every Flat Tax proposal I've ever read about, someone making $900 a month ($10,800 annually) wouldn't pay a dime in taxes. Just like it is now.

It's not a strawman. I read what you said. What's the difference between a man making 900 dollars and the man making 9000 dollars? Why is it fair to exempt the man making 900 from the flat tax? Because he doesn't make enough? Then what's the difference between not making enough and making too much? Is 9000 enough? What if the man makes more than 900 but less than 9000? What if he makes less than 900? What if he can't make it even without having to pay taxes? Fuck him? We're not making the wealthy pay an extra half a percent in taxes to help that man out because that would be unfair? That's your position.

[Ashendant]

Except the rich are left with 9.000.000 and the poor are left with 9.000, 9.000 might not be enough to survive(i don't live in america so i don't know the prices) while 9.000.000 is just too much cash for a person to recieve monthly

That's one fairly weak argument you've got there.

The inherent vice of capitalism is the unequal sharing of blessings; the inherent virtue of socialism is the equal sharing of miseries.

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I forgot to post the rest midway, while a person with lots of cash will have too much cash than it's needed for the daily routine, people with less cash won't have enough cash to fill his daily routine

And don't give me the shit about equality this is as unequal as it gets, if you truly supported equality you would tax until they have the same exact amount of cash

If i ran the world i would get rid of high class and the lower class, by taking the excessive cash from the first to give to the second, so we would have only the middle class, and that would be equality

[Jaysyn]

What's the difference between a man making 900 dollars and the man making 9000 dollars?

$8100

Why is it fair to exempt the man making 900 from the flat tax?

Because it would be an undue burden on a very poor person? That's not so hard to understand is it?

What if the man makes more than 900 but less than 9000?

Then he may or may not need to pay a federal flat tax depending exactly how much he makes?

What if he makes less than 900? What if he can't make it even without having to pay taxes? Fuck him?

Then he'd probably be on public assistance, kind of like we have now?

We're not making the wealthy pay an extra half a percent in taxes to help that man out because that would be unfair?

But at 10% the "wealthy man" is already paying $10800 / year in taxes. More than that could be considered an undue burden as well.

That's your position.

Well it's more like a thought experiment, but call it what you'd like.

[Tiberius]

*sigh*

Equality doesn't mean people should be the same, it means people should be treated the same. The world doesn't work if you just take money form the rich and give it to the poor, for various reasons. Ignoring the fact that this behaviour is unfair in the first place (what right do you have to take that money, and what right do the poor have to it?), the main problem with spreading the wealth is that you remove any incentive to actually work. What is the point of working when you know the government will just give you free money? What is the point of inventing a new product if you know you can't sell it and take a decent profit? The market will just stop working, and without the market, you won't have anything being produced, so good luck actually feeding and clothing your population.

Society needs high earners who create jobs for the low earners. Society needs low earners to take those jobs in order for the high earners to create more jobs. It is a circle of growth, and it works.