Simon Moon Wrote:Gandalf promised them 72 virgin Hobbits.

Wait... Why was I not told of this sooner?!?

(April 19, 2016 at 9:00 pm)Simon Moon Wrote:

(April 19, 2016 at 8:56 pm)MysticKnight Wrote: I agree with that. If I am God's representative, then I am a sorry choice, which definitely proves I am not. But even if people all thought I was high and pure, without proof from God, I would be a wrong choice to assume by people. Who and what qualities do you expect in who represents God and his teachings?

I would expect a representative that can provide demonstrable, falsifiable evidence and reasoned argument for the existence of their god. 

Better yet, if a god actually did exist, he would know exactly what I need in order to believe he exists, and be able to provide it unambiguously. He wouldn't need a representative.

What other qualities would you expect. I agree on what you said so far. A representative of God must able to do that but what other qualities would you assume he must have?

(April 19, 2016 at 9:00 pm)MysticKnight Wrote:

(April 19, 2016 at 8:53 pm)SteelCurtain Wrote: Again, sing to your heart's content. I don't care if you want to tell me how to live. I'm a big boy with a big brain, I'll talk back.

It's when you try to enact laws that codify your beliefs that I get loud.

And what if a leader one day you see on TV says I am the representative of God, I am the chosen one of God, I am the successor of the last of the Prophets, I am this and that, and majority of the world support him, and want to form and rally around him. And majority of believe in him.

What would you do? Would you fight him? Or would you let him be? Would you just intellectually try to defeat him or would you fight him if most of the world believed in him?

If he tried to substantially burden my life with laws and prohibitions, he'll be out on his ass in no time. This is 'Murrica, son. While wet pretend to be pious and Godly, we like our guns and porn and beer and freedom.

(April 19, 2016 at 8:59 pm)Stimbo Wrote:

(April 19, 2016 at 8:37 pm)MysticKnight Wrote: But why focus on gods...and it seems a lot of people are saying the problem they are having is that people claiming to be his representatives are trying to dictate to humanity on how to live.

You're making this much harder for yourself than it really needs to be. The response to theistic claims and beliefs is a legitimate area of discussion. Scepticism is the arching term, within which - to coin a phrase - there are many mansions. They specialise individually in such things as ghosts, ESP, UFOs, cryptozoology, spoon-bending and so on. You just happen to be asking these questions on a forum in one of those mansions devoted to atheism, that's all.

If it helps, maybe compare it to the word 'science', within which broad subject are dedicated fields such as mathematics, physics, astronomy, chemistry, biology etc. Though different subjects, with a certain degree of overlap, a physicist, a biologist and an astronomer are still all scientists.

Well yes I am curious about Atheists and why they gather.

(April 19, 2016 at 9:03 pm)MysticKnight Wrote:

(April 19, 2016 at 9:00 pm)Simon Moon Wrote: I would expect a representative that can provide demonstrable, falsifiable evidence and reasoned argument for the existence of their god. 

Better yet, if a god actually did exist, he would know exactly what I need in order to believe he exists, and be able to provide it unambiguously. He wouldn't need a representative.

What other qualities would you expect. I agree on what you said so far. A representative of God must able to do that but what other qualities would you assume he must have?

I don't care about other qualities. 

All I care about is demonstrable, falsifiable evidence and reasoned argument.

(April 19, 2016 at 8:53 pm)MysticKnight Wrote: Ok, but this is exactly what I'm saying. You don't like being told "you must believe in this and follow this path or follow this and that or do this and that and don't do this and that". The core of the issue is you hate the notion of dictating on what to do.

No, the core issue is people dictating how others live based upon their religious beliefs. Religious beliefs are to be kept personal, and just as I have no right to dictate that you should live your life as if there is no god, you have no right to dictate that I live mine as if there is.

(April 19, 2016 at 8:53 pm)MysticKnight Wrote: But if there is no God, you have everyone doing that anyways, You have people making laws, you have society making morals, which differs society to society, and then you have your own confused self that just picks from here and there but mostly finds it's self agreeing to the people he feels identified with the most (atheists). But if there is a God, then who is more worthy to be listened and obeyed and followed and who more worthy of guiding to the truth then the wise knowing creator?

Well, we don't have a "wise knowing creator" guiding us to the truth, do we? All we have are believers with impotent arguments that insist god exists despite a complete inability to produce even the tiniest scrap of evidence of its existence.

And therein lies the rub and the crux of your confusion. The believer seems unable to distinguish between their beliefs and what can be proven.

(April 19, 2016 at 9:04 pm)SteelCurtain Wrote:

(April 19, 2016 at 9:00 pm)MysticKnight Wrote: And what if a leader one day you see on TV says I am the representative of God, I am the chosen one of God, I am the successor of the last of the Prophets, I am this and that, and majority of the world support him, and want to form and rally around him. And majority of believe in him.

What would you do? Would you fight him? Or would you let him be? Would you just intellectually try to defeat him or would you fight him if most of the world believed in him?

If he tried to substantially burden my life with laws and prohibitions, he'll be out on his ass in no time. This is 'Murrica, son. While wet pretend to be pious and Godly, we like our guns and porn and beer and freedom.

You made me smile. But what if he leaves each country to it's own, but you seeing that every country has majority supporting him. For example, what if majority of Americans supported him?

(April 19, 2016 at 9:05 pm)Simon Moon Wrote:

(April 19, 2016 at 9:03 pm)MysticKnight Wrote: What other qualities would you expect. I agree on what you said so far. A representative of God must able to do that but what other qualities would you assume he must have?

I don't care about other qualities. 

All I care about is demonstrable, falsifiable evidence and reasoned argument.

Really so if someone proved God existed, you would follow him? Why would you do that? I don't mean to follow regarding claim of God, I mean in follow the path of God (if God exists).

(April 19, 2016 at 7:52 pm)MysticKnight Wrote: It's so obvious Leprechaun's have no proof of existence. So much so we should support ourselves for not believing them, don't you guys think?
So who is with me, Aleprechaunsforums.com?
And don't forget Pixies. We need Apixiesforums.com, because it's so obvious to us we have no proof of their existence, that we need to support one another for it!
Right?
ahobbitsforums.com atrollsforums.com where is our peer support groups for what obviously we have no reason to believe in?

Haven't seen any Leprechauns or Pixies forcing what people can and can't do with their own bodies, limit the freedom of those bodies or trying to alter what's taught in schools, or... why bother...

(April 19, 2016 at 9:04 pm)MysticKnight Wrote: Well yes I am curious about Atheists and why they gather.

Personally I don't like it when theists look at me like I have three heads when they find out I don't subscribe to their brand of bulshit - so online I prefer to hang around with people who won't do that, because at least here I have that choice. The only way I can do that IRL is to keep my mouth shut. Fuck that.

IOW you need only look at the behavior of (some) theists and a bit of empathy to understand.